Vatican City, Sep 18, 2017 / 01:57 pm (CNA/EWTN News).- Nearly four years after the Pope established his Council of Cardinal advisers to help him in the task of reforming the Roman Curia, one member of the group said their work is wrapping up, and that it could take only a few more meetings to finish what they set out to do.
The ongoing process of reform “is being done at various stages of development, and I hope we’ll come to an end in all of these matters soon,” Cardinal Oswald Gracias of Bombay told CNA Sept. 14.
“It will take two or three more meetings more,” he said, adding that “by June perhaps we’ll be seeing the end of the tunnel.”
Cardinal Gracias is also President of the Asian Bishops Conference and in 2013 was chosen by the Pope along with eight other prelates from around the world to advise him in matters of Church governance and reform.
He spoke to CNA in a lengthy, sit-down interview after the council – also called the “C9” – concluded their latest round of meetings last week.
As far as the reform goes, Cardinal Gracias said “there won’t be very major changes; it’s the governance of the Church, we can’t just turn everything upside down.” Rather, it will be “a gradual change, a change of mentality, a change of approach, restructuring a bit of the departments so that they are more logically suited to the needs of today.”
He said a key goal of the C9 is to implement the vision of the Second Vatican Council, specifically when it comes to the importance of the role of the laity and women, and incorporating greater synodality and collegiality into the Church’s structures.
From the beginning Pope Francis “had very clear what he wanted this group to do,” the cardinal said. “He had no hesitation, he’s a good leader. He had a clear vision.”
Cardinal Gracias admitted that in the beginning he had doubts as to whether or not they were going in the right direction, and had started to worry what people on the outside might say, since many fruits of the meetings weren’t and likely won’t be immediately visible. He said he also struggled with doubts about the pace at which they were moving, and believed that things were going “too slow.”
“I will confess that once at the beginning I was wondering, ‘are we going in the right direction?’ I asked myself. But now I can see it is,” he said, explaining that Pope Francis’ Christmas speech to the Roman Curia last year was a “tipping point” for him.
More than anything, there is a change in mentality that’s needed, which will take longer than simply reforming the Vatican’s structures, he said, but said the group is “rather confident that it will happen because the Pope is giving very effective leadership.”
In addition to the ongoing curial reform, Cardinal Gracias also spoke about the recent release of Indian priest Fr. Tom Uzhunnalil 18 months after he was abducted in Yemen. He also spoke about the Pope’s upcoming trip to Myanmar and Bangladesh, and when a possible papal trip to India might take place.
Below are excerpts from CNA’s interview with Cardinal Gracias:
You’ve seen Fr. Tom and you were at his meeting with Pope Francis. How is he doing?
I was pleasantly surprised with calmness with which he came out, because he did not know, to my knowledge, that he was being released. But he said I know people have prayed for me, I’m grateful for the people who were praying for me, but he kept on saying ‘Jesus is great, Jesus is great.’ And then he told the Holy Father. It was a very moving moment. As soon as the Holy Father came he prostrated in front of the Holy Father and kissed his feet, and he said, ‘thank you, thank you, thank you. Thank you Holy Father, but just one message I want to give you: Jesus Christ is great. Jesus was with me right through, I could sense the presence of God with me’…And once I thought the Holy Father had tears in his eyes. When Tom kept on speaking about Jesus, this is what he told the Holy Father: please tell the people that Jesus is great! I would say that he’s come out of it with an experience of the presence of the Lord, and I think at that moment the Holy Father had tears in his eyes…I met the Holy Father later that afternoon, and he was telling me how impressed he was. He was also surprised with the calmness of the man, with Tom…He was a man who is perhaps strengthened in the faith after this experience, and not bitter about anything. Particularly about his captors, he was very understanding. It was a special experience, very edifying. He needs rest, certainly, he’ll have a medical exam and he’ll be with his superiors, but eventually he’ll go back (to India). So thank God really. It was an anxious moment for the whole Church in India. We didn’t know what was happening, but we understood that putting more pressure, in the perspective of the government, could make things more difficult for him. (But) he’s not really stressed in any way you can make out. Physically weak, but spiritually strong. When he met the Holy Father, he was weeping right through it. And the Holy Father was very touched, he kissed his hand and blessed him…He felt the comfort and strength of the entire Church. As he said, there was never a moment when he felt abandoned, either by the Church or by God. He kept saying, ‘Jesus is great.’ So he came out spiritually strengthened in that sense. It was a big relief, a big blessing, and the Holy Father was overjoyed. I think the government of Oman did a very splendid job of helping out…they even brought a Salesian to accompany him on the last plane. It was very human of them, so had the comfort of a spiritual companion.
What role did the Holy See play in working out his release?
They only offered help, they kept the issue open and kept sharing. The Holy See was told he was alive, and the Holy See communicated with the Indian government. In Yemen, the political situation is very fragile, and one doesn’t know who is in charge. There are bombardments and all sorts of groups are taking over, so there was always a risk I suppose, that if you tried to liberate him you could have harmed him. But they were always interested, they kept it alive. Every time I came to Rome somebody from the Secretariat of State updated me. The Vatican made sure there was interest. Any information the Holy See had, they shared it with the Indian government, the Omani government, so that was good.
It’s interesting that there is still no word on who is responsible…
It’s not a terrorist attack, it’s a kidnapping. They wouldn’t glory in taking him. That has not come out. I spent about half an hour with him before the Holy Father, and he was speaking continuously. I did not at any point attempt to ask him questions, because I think that would be a stress for him. He has got to share…he wants to share it and then I imagine you feel lighter. He’s probably just got to rest, and rest and rest, physically and then mentally too, he’s got to get it out of his mind. He’s not come out of it a broken man at all. I was afraid of that, that he would come out a broken man, but no…It’s a moment of grace, a moment of faith, a special experience. The high point was when he told the Holy Father, ‘just tell everybody that Jesus is great, Jesus is great.’ Just three simple words. That was like the sum of his whole experience, what he meant and why he meant it…he felt not abandoned, I suppose. I hope recovers. I imagine he needs a couple of months really, or maybe more than a couple of months, to really rest. He needs time with the family also, natural circumstances…I’m not sure about this, but I have a feeling that the Omani government decided to bring him to Rome, because they (wanted) to hand him over to the Vatican. I think it was better for him, because I think if he had gone to India he would have been mobbed by everybody. He just needs space to recover, and for doctors to examine him. Physically to see if he’s alright, and psychologically also, to be investigated. I think it was a wise decision, but I think it was a decision more of the Omani government.
I don’t want to exploit your time, but I wanted to ask a few questions about the process of reform and the C9. You just finished your latest round of meetings…
Yes, we just finished the latest round, the 21st meeting. I can’t imagine we’ve had 21. I didn’t realize it’s 21 already. I think we are working hard. What’s nice is that we’re a cohesive group now. In the beginning we were all (gestures). Now we know each other so well and we work together, and of course trying to implement the Holy Father’s vision of the Church. Also, one of the things we always say, and it’s very clear, before the conclave the cardinals had spoken a lot of their vision of the Church, and we have the texts of what all of the cardinals said, and all the cardinals gave their vision. We picked up from that, the Holy Father picked up from that, his own vision. We’ve focused so far … it’s for a dual purpose that the group was formed: one is to help him help him in the governance of the universal Church, and the second is to revise Pastor bonus, the papal document of St. John Paul II for establishing the Curia and giving the job descriptions and the vision of each dicastery. It’s to revitalize, I suppose that’s what Pope Francis wants us to do, and to have a new mentality which is applying Vatican II also; how to make the Roman Curia at the service of the Holy Father more effectively, but the Churches at the local level, the Churches in the dioceses, how to make the Roman Curia assist the local Churches to be more effective pastorally, so they can be more vibrant in that sense. So I think the holy Father is satisfied with what’s happening. I’m satisfied too with the way we are going ahead. We come for three days and work intensely, we work from 9:00 on the first day to 7:00 (pm) on the last day trying to wrap things up, but lots of work has been done. But it’s coming to the end. I think it will take maybe two or three more meetings until we wrap up our conclusions about the dicasteries. Then of course the Holy Father will study the thing and decide. So we’re going well. The feedback we receive is the Holy Father is happy, he is satisfied, and he has been using the Christmas messages sometimes to give an indication, a little progress report, so this year’s Christmas message (2016). I didn’t realize it, but when I read it I realized it’s practically giving a progress report of what this group has been doing. I hope that it will make an impact. There won’t be very major changes; it’s the governance of the Church, we can’t just turn everything upside down. But a gradual change, a change of mentality, a change of approach, restructuring a bit of the departments so that they are more logically suited to the needs of today, and also of answering the vision of the Second Vatican Council: the importance of lay people, synodality, collegiality, then concern about women, getting more women involved, then giving importance to the local Churches. Then reflecting on the role of episcopal conferences in all this, because that’s another big issue. So all of this is being done at various stages of development, and I hope we’ll come to an end in all of these matters soon. It will take two or three more meetings more, I foresee at least February, June…by June perhaps we’ll be seeing the end of the tunnel.
It’s been a long process…
It’s been a really long process, really, but it’s good. I’ve been in other committees of this sort, in which at the beginning we don’t what we’re doing, where to begin, and they you find your way and you find your vision. But here it was very clear, the Holy Father had very clear what he wanted this group to do…we were not clear in why we were called and what he wanted to do, but gradually we understood his mind. He had no hesitation, he’s a good leader. He had a clear vision and he had his people with him. He’s there with us, he genuinely doesn’t take any other appointments. He’s there except the general audience. There are emergencies of course, this time there were lots of things happening, but he participates and he listens to discussion, and every now and then he raises his hand when he wants to speak. It’s very odd, but now we’re accustomed to it, the Pope raising his hand (laughs) … it’s very valuable, he’s part of the discussion all the way through, completely inserted right in the thick of it. Certainly he doesn’t speak that much, because I think we would feel inhibited and want to go in his direction. So it’s just the right amount and at the right time.
Well he’s very much about the process, isn’t he? He doesn’t want to interrupt the process that’s happening…
Yes, absolutely. And he’s happy. And everybody speaks their mind. We know each other so well, and we know that the Holy Father wants us to speak our minds, so no one is at any stage (overly) conscious that the Pope is there with us, no…but it’s going well, I think it’s going well. I will confess that once at the beginning I was wondering, ‘are we going in the right direction?’ I asked myself. But now I can see it is. He’s a man of deep faith, the Pope. I remember having spoken to him once about the synod, I was sharing him my anxieties on whether the synods were going well, and he told me, ‘Cardinal, I am not worried.’ He told me that. I told him I was worried, I don’t know what direction we’re taking, whether we’ll be able in two synods to give your vision. (He said) ‘I’m not worried. It’ll work out.’ He knows what he wants, he’s a good Jesuit, and the Jesuits know exactly what they want.
At what point were you convinced that things were going in the right direction?
After about seven or eight or nine meetings, I was beginning to wonder. My worry was what will the world say? Everybody knows we’re meeting over here, but we are very limited in what we say are the fruits. What are these eight men – nine, we became nine after the Secretary (of State) joined – the nine cardinals are coming and discussing here, what’s happening? They’re not just coming here for debate. I was worried about the fruits not being seen, and the process being too slow. But then, especially after I heard the Holy Father’s speech (at Christmas 2016), for me that was it. I was like, wow, there has been a lot done. That was absolutely…this past Christmas, it was like a progress report of this group. I’m in the group, right, but I never realized the number of things we had really discussed. Besides modifying the document, the protection of minors, the economy, updates on these things, general principles of collegiality, synodality, we’re thinking about these things. Care of the Curia personnel. It’s everything that the Holy Father…he isn’t like us, who when we go back home we’re fully in the diocese, he has this in mind and he keeps working on this fully afterwards. We go back to our dioceses and are concerned about the local Church, but he certainly follows up with what we say. I’ve seen it several times. He takes the group very seriously. Every now and then he would ask us to take up some point on the agenda to discuss it a bit, which he wants advice on. I think it’s a new system he has started in which he gets feedback from all over the world, and he gets it from the grassroots. I think, anyway, I hope. We come from different continents and we bring in our own experiences. But it is going well. In fact I really, really think there has been a contribution to the Holy Father, and then the Holy Father takes decisions. I have a feeling this is shared by all now. I have no doubt, this would be the general feeling of all about it. The tipping point was really his speech, but already before that, say about six or seven months before that, we began to see really when we reflected that…perhaps the Holy Father knew that that was in our minds. It was in my mind, and maybe I expressed it indirectly. And the Holy Father once commented also, he said ‘we have done this much, so don’t get discouraged.’ So at one stage he sort of answered that doubt in my mind.
You mentioned that there’s also a change of mentality needed. Other than the structural shifts, it seems that the change of mentality will be the more challenging task…
That will take longer. But we hope it will percolate down, because once you have a certain mentality you generally don’t change unless the circumstances change, the ambiance changes. And in a certain sense not changing dramatically. That will I think take longer. But I’m positive that it will happen. We’re very, very hopeful. We’re rather confident that it will happen because the Pope is giving very effective leadership, and every now and then there is a clear message from him. But it will come about and suddenly we’ll realize, oh there has been a change! That’s how it will happen. It won’t come overnight, but at a certain point we’ll realize things have changed. He knows what he wants. And he’s happy. Certainly the indication I can see is this way; the relationship he has with the group and the joy he has in being with the group. He says he feels that it has helped him. Thank God. We do what we can. I don’t know how or why he chose us, but he’s happy. I was very surprised when I got a call from him. I said ‘why me? What have I done?’ I suppose he knows. I don’t know why. I did not know the Holy Father before, we’ve never been in any other committee before. Only at the conclave. I don’t even remember having chatted with him at the conclave, or before the conclave. After the conclave it was true that I was with him. It’s true that after I was with the Pope at Santa Marta for a few days. Then we were having meals together – breakfast, lunch and dinner for four or five days. That’s the time we came to know each other. So we were thrown together for about a week. It struck me that after his election I was at Santa Marta, because there were five or six cardinals. All the American cardinals were there, the European cardinals, all the ones from close by left and came back (for the installation). I stayed for the installation and then went back to India. And then you share, when you speak. He was very comfortable with us, very comfortable with me. But still, he had to make a choice.
Has he mentioned anything about when a visit to India might take place?
He’s very interested. We’re working it out, and I’m very hopeful. He would like to come and we would like to have him, and the government would like to have him. But now we must see his program, the government’s program, but I’m certain he will come. There are no details at all for the moment. I’m rather certainly positive that we will be able to get the Holy Father, he’s interested and I think he’s getting more interested. And the people will be excited…we are looking forward. In the beginning, as soon as he was elected, I asked him, ‘when are you coming to India?’ And he was sort of (disinterested), but gradually he began to like the idea. He’s never been to India before. As a Jesuit I think he was supposed to go to Japan, that’s what he was telling me. He’s going now to Bangladesh and Myanmar. It will be very sensitive. Bangladesh has it’s own problems, I believe they have elections next year, and Myanmar has problems to solve, also the refugee problem at the moment. Of late it is continuously on, I believe yesterday or this morning I saw it on CNN, and BBC is reporting on it. It’s an issue for the world. I’ve been there (Bangladesh) a few times. It’s a nice Church, concentrated mostly in Dhaka, a living faith. I’ve been to Myanmar also, I went as a papal legate there some years back, and I found the Church very vibrant. A simple faith, but I’m happy. I think it will mean a lot to the people. It will also strengthen the people. I think the Church is also very vibrant, it’s not have any specific difficulty, in my impression as a papal legate about two or three years back, but I was very impressed by the faith and the organization. It was vibrant. The Church was small, but strong and alive. It will make a difference for the Churches, and for the governments I expect.
Will you be there?
I plan to go to both places yes. In all of these trips in Asian I’ve come along: Sri Lanka, Korea, the Philippines. At the moment I’m president of the Asian Bishops Conference, so I suppose in that capacity I’ll have to go.
[…]
Of course it apologizes, (unless you are tradition, then you are vilified) that’s all our church does these days…
Forget about the kerygma, it’s become alphabet (lmnopqrst+) soup…
And yet another demoralizing and discouraging action from the Vatican. I feel like Charlie Brown, “Isn’t there anyone who knows what Christmas is all about?”
All is smoke and mirrors. Close the page on this pope. Say your prayers, receive the Holy Sacraments and ignore this Vatican. It’s a fraudulent, disgraceful joke.
AMEN!!!
You summed it up perfectly. A blessed advent to you and yours.
They might as well send up a signal flare announcing their intentions.
And this bit — “Walking together also means knowing how to apologize” — made me burst out laughing.
The synod on synodality: an echo chamber of malcontents.
Well, if you’re as old as I am you might recall the sappy line from the even sappier “Love Story” film. At fifteen I thought it was soooooo profound 😂😂😂😂. “Love means never having to say you’re sorry!” And now the zeitgeist proclaims the opposite…. We live in interesting times, yes? God’s Peace be with you and yours.
How very multicultural, the Church’s (?) loosely defined synod on synodality has just committed hari-kari. That didn’t take long. Pope James Martin, take a bow, but first see who has your back.
We are reminded that the efforts at the synod on the family, by the relator general, to recognize the LGBTQ community, or any categorization of persons, was rebuffed in the final report of the Synod on the Family (a slogan never actually raised at the synod). The bishops, en mass, successfully “demanded” that his editorial license be removed.
And we notice here, again, that the term “family” is curiously excluded in the vanedecum for the synod on synodality. Instead, the grab bag to which “ETC.” can and now does mean anything–rendering equivalent the traditional family and now the full spectrum (rectum?) of gender theory.
From the Vanedecum (synodal guidelines): “…women, the handicapped, refugees, migrants, the elderly, people who live in poverty, Catholics who rarely or never practice their faith, ETC. [and then] children and youth [….] people who have left the practice of the faith, people of other faith traditions, people of no religious belief, ETC.”
A big word, this here ETC. thingy…missing in seminary training, in this day and age, is a good course in counterespionage.
Another blatant false report from the increasingly trashy CNA, which claims that “New Ways is the only group focused exclusively on ministry to people with same-sex attraction.” Not true. They are, and have always been active in promoting abortion “rights” as well.
I am glad you pointed this out. CNA continues to be cited as a source of authentic Catholic journalism by people who should know better. In fact, CNA is at best merely the bureaucratic mouthpiece of USCCB policies. At its worst, it is every bit as dissenting as the worst rags out there, such as National Catholic Reporter and CruxNow.
Mr. Baker, I do not think you are interpreting the text correctly. The antecedent to the sentence you quote is in the paragraph above. Thus, New Ways is the only group *of the four categorized as informal organizations* that is focused exclusively on ministry to people with same-sex attraction. I believe that the author was safe to assume that readers would know that there are at large several ministries with this focus, including very orthodox ones like Courage International. While I would not say that the writing in this section of the article is perfectly clear, I take issue with your crude accusation that CNA is “trashy.”
As to the apology and link to New Ways, I find these actually trashy.
So you think their venomous slanders of Archbishop Vigano were “non-trashy?”
It occurs to me, has anyone heard anything about a Vatican synod for Catholics?
The only surprise that could come from the Vatican at this point is actually standing up for the teaching of the Catholic Church.
Ape church in full bloom…
At this point in time a faithful Catholic is better off writing off everything coming from the current Vatican leadership, and the current Pope (especially his plane interviews and “off the cuff” remarks) as it has become a sad joke. I miss Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI and Saint John Paul II.
Homosexuality is repulsive and akin to bestiality.
May the Beloved One have Mercy on His suffering Church.
Is this not a defining moment on the contemporary episcopate from the Holy See right on down? The chess game of praxis over and above decree is nothing but nefarious and mendacious. “Let your ‘Yes’ mean ‘Yes,’ and your ‘No’ mean ‘No.’ Anything more is from the evil one.” Matthew 5:37
Recently I came across a report that the USCCB is concerned about the lack of trust the episcopate generates among the faithful. I was surprised to see that they had that much self-awareness. Their concern is obviously about cosmetics over and above personal reform. They are addicted to lip service and it will be their end.
It is gut wrenching.
One cannot but recall Elijah and his elimination of the prophets of Baal.
The Vatican handbook says to include all the baptized. That is now taken to mean including all those who officially oppose Church teaching. How interesting it will be to see the final outcome.
The full plan has always been to destroy the Catholic Church,and continues to be going
forward unabated.Just as the Germans did at the Battle of the Bulge by wearing American uniforms and changing the road signs.Today we see the same plan in play again.As the Germans Bishops started this latest assault.As this Pope & Vatican wears the uniform,but
has been changing the road signs to confuse the Faithful about which road to take to victory.
LGBTQ are not identifiers of persons. Homosexuality and other sexual disorders exist only as the most vile of contraventions to the genuine human nature a result of our being imparted the very nature of our Creator. They are mischaracterizations of what are disorders and should NEVER be referenced by the true Catholic Church in any other way than this. Illegitimately constructed organizations founded around to these disorders or disordered behaviors have no seat at any table or legitimate place in any dialogue where the constructs of genuine Catholicism are discussed or deliberated. As faithful Catholics we have no need or obligation to discuss our business with Satan or those who serve Him, whether they claim to be members of Jesus’ one true Church or not. Any pseudo Catholic, by virtue of their identification in this manner as being genuine Catholics when they are not should be summarily discharged from any deliberation concerning the constructs of our faith and ejected from our midst. This includes clerical persons and entities that embrace these deadly disorders. Enshrinement of filthy practices and the embrace of homosexual misuse of procreative and other human organs has no place where faithful Catholics are assembled. Few Catholics understand that such practices and discussions are always predatory, particularly where children can become proximate and can never be made otherwise. Any acknowledgement except outright rejection by our Church officials is the work of Satan and a betrayal of the faithful.
Yes, “predatory”…
How else to explain that a sexual disorder oriented against reproducing itself is resulting in an ever-growing number of homosexuals? So, either sexual abuse or getting locked in by early experimentation. One would expect real bishops to notice this, and instead of lending a hand (so to speak), seizing this teaching moment with such posting as the Church’s truth-speaking compassion and compassionate truth speaking, and maybe a bit about the science as well:
https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19861001_homosexual-persons_en.html
https://news.yahoo.com/no-gay-gene-study-finds-180220669.html
For a hierarchy very concerned about losing the next generation, why be goaded now into throwing them under the bus?
Excellent perceptive response of the ever increasing perversion. Indications are that the predatory nature of this moral disease spreads with contact like a virus.
Unfortunately, as you must realize this missed opportunity is likely obeisance to papal policy, a predilection to embrace rather than instruct the disenfranchised sinner, bishops aware of being accused in the past of throwing stones. So they submit to making nice rather than rescue the sheep lost in the wilderness. A policy that appears under the guise of mercy more a new age message of, Be who you are, we love you as you are no need to repent and conform to Christ’s commandments. Some Catholics convince themselves a doctrine of surprises of doctrines contrary to Apostolic tradition is the new and blessed path. A path not the narrow one appealed to and taken by Christ.
More on the science of LGBTQ…
FIRST, the authors of a 2019 study which claimed so-called gender-transition surgery may improve the long-term mental health of recipients issued a CORRECTION, nearly a year after publication. The authors now report that: “the results demonstrated no advantage of surgery in relation to subsequent mood or anxiety disorder-related health care.”
https://www.catholicworldreport.com/2020/08/04/researchers-reverse-gender-surgery-offers-no-advantage-to-mental-health/
SECOND, instead of saying “God made you that way,” maybe the Vatican megaphones might consider possible cases where inadvertent (environmental) CHEMICAL INTERFERENCE in the fetus, for example, later disrupts what God has created? The new scientific question is whether fetal absorption of EDCs (endocrine disruptive chemicals) can block normal hormonal development toward physically/emotionally integrated male and female children at birth? (Chemicals associated with endocrine-disrupting ability in humans include organochlorine pesticides, polychlorinated biphenyls, bisphenol A, phthalates, dioxins, and furans.)
Any enthusiasm from the Pontifical Council of Whatever–or maybe from the synods!!!–for encouraging preventive action and corrective medicine (part of Laudato si’s “integral ecology”!)? But maybe the pharmaceuticals won’t see any market or money in it, especially if status quo LGBTQ is mainstream even for the Church.
In any event, sound moral theology regarding the immorality of sexual activity outside of fully human marriage still applies equally for all—for sexual-abuse victims, or locked-in experimenters, or those chemically damaged before birth, no less than for binary/complementary males and females.
Agreed the spectre of an error of nature [Aquinas assumed there were though very rare] of which there are indications, and the possibility of chemical interference we should, until more data arrives consider the disorder a predominant elective behavior. That is the reasoned, moral premise for psychiatric, psychological therapy for sufferers of the disorder [often a socio psychologic syndrome stemming from infancy]. That viable treatment is under attack as a liberty interference or against nature itself.
But at the least we do know of the indisputable ideological components. It is impossible for it to be coincidental that those committed to sexual deviancy support abortion at a rate of 98 percent according to reliable surveys. And it is equally impossible for there not to be a potentially widespread component of personal pride in the gay supporting souls of those unwilling to seriously consider the damaging repercussions of sexual deviancy.
A potential homosexual disposition would likely be more psychological. Whatever the origin, most gays have lives of a habituated pursuit of justifying an avoidance of physical burdens, a reluctance to endure discomfort with a resigned and dignified sense of manliness. In time, they learn to bond with others who share weakness.
As Fr. Mankowski asked, we can in turn ask The Pontiff Francis and his Synodal Team: “Is sodomy a sin?”
Have they not heard of https://couragerc.org/
Why is this organization not listed? Is it because they try to live according to the traditional teachings of the Church? According to the Theology of the Body by St John Paul II?
Amen! I too am asking the same question as to why Courage is not listed. The Catholic Church through this Apostolate has been helping same-sex attracted men, women, and their families since 1987 with the Truth.
The entire Synodal thingy has been to me blatantly obvious from the get go. The mission I fear is to dilute the faithful with the “marginalized” to the point that our doctrine will be nothing more than any common Christian sect. But, we will have equity, equality, and on and on……….
Have never trusted this Argentinian
Jim, fear not. This Synodal thingy has absolutely nothing to do with doctrine. It is all about structure and evangelization. Trust the Holy Spirit. Millions of Catholics all over the world are praying for it to succeed. Prayers are always answered.
I am an ex-catholic and wow, after what I have been reading, God led me away from this whole mess. When did the catholic church start embracing homosexuality and transgenderism since the bible clearly denounces it, i.e. Deuteronomy 22: 5-8 transgenderism is called “an abomination”. Paul’s letters clearly denounce homosexuality and any unnatural sexual act as perverted and sinful. I am beginning to wonder if the catholic church has many LGBTQ in its leadership – seems like they do, otherwise why would they allow this!
Walking away from the faith was the exact WRONG answer. Just because these reprobates, and in worst cases, should the pope himself live/preach contrary to the faith, it does not change the faith. As Christ said, “let the dead bury their own dead, you follow me.” The Catholic faith cannot and will not ever change. Follow not these current reprobates, but leaving the faith made you an apostate, a mortal sin you will have to reckon with at your particular judgment. I urge you to about face and come back…”when the ground is dry, the roots sink deeper to find moisture, and thus, the tree becomes stronger.”
Bringing the Good News to deviants is holy. Dancing with them is demonic.
The confusion is real, but the “Good”news is that the Church is NOT of this world totally. The Real Church exists as Body and Spirit. The Good Lord is not hung up on anything–he is God remember. The fight is with the World and the present Pope is the Shepherd… Rf
True, but again the Church exists to help us reach the Kingdom. The scary part is that
God is a Trinity and is both\and Divine and Human– a tough concept to wrap our
heads around. Watch how the Pro-Life issue is going to go.
So very sad to see how people who consider themselves good Catholics are so confused that they do not recognize the actual continuity from Pope John Paul II canonized by Pope Francis through the beautiful orthodoxy of Pope Benedict XVI on to this present day. Rather than take a careful look at their own openness to the mysterious, unexpected and unlikely movements of the Holy Spirit, they are quick to criticize and condemn! Do we or do we not trust the words of Christ to be with us to the end of time? Are we or are we not willing to accept the doctrine of papal infallibility? The Church goes on not based on right or left knee-jerk reactions to statements it would do us good to reflect upon and learn to recognize as faithful to the Gospel with its many surprises for the scribes and Pharisees when Jesus spoke and acted in unpredictable ways!
What are you talking about? The Holy Spirit does not “surprise” anyone with moral assertions that are contradictory to moral absoluteness. That’s one very large misunderstanding we have heard from the current Vatican staff. The problem here is, that the majority of reprobate James Martin and his followers don’t come to the table with penitent contrite hearts, rather, they want Church doctrine to change to accept their lifestyles. It does not work that way. Period. The Holy Spirit is a spirit of truth, not deceit. Homosexuality has been around for thousands of years, why is it, or should it in any way now be acceptable by the Church. God made us male and female, not to be defined by our sexuality. We are to have control of our passions. If you lose control, you repent. This ambiguous approach to what’s right or wrong is only from the evil one. At the end of the most perfect prayer, Christ says, “…deliver us from the evil one.” Thus, it is a sin to put ourselves in the devils path. You know clearly the heart of this matter. You are choosing to play naive. Also, Papal “infallibility” only exists ex cathedra, not on personal interpretation or opinion! If the pope wakes up tomorrow and says homosexuality is ok, even in certain situations, he would be wrong!!! He would not be speaking ex cathedra. Ridiculous to even have to speak to another “Catholic” about this. St Augustine says, “for I think a law that is not just, is not actually a law.”
Pray tell, on what basis are you assuming that what Francis is doing is led by the Holy Spirit?
I agree with you, Sister. Our Lord also had to put up with criticism and taunts from “religious people” the Pharisees. “When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: “Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?” On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.” Mark 2:16-17
And why would you abuse the words of the Gospels to insult Christ and His Church to affirm purposes that are opposed Christ and His Church? Our Lord’s purpose in reaching sinners was to seek their repentance, not to endorse their sins. Contemporary Pharisees are those elitists who align themselves with an elitist secularizing Pope.
Kathleen says: “The Church goes on not based on right or left knee-jerk reactions to statements…”
The Church which follows Jesus listens to Him and does as He taught. Without hesitation Jesus rebuked and condemned error and sin by sharp verbal criticism.
“And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.” (Luke 4:8)
“But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.” (Matthew 16:23)
If sister is still confused, she could jerk her knees to take up Scripture at Mark 8:33 or Matthew 4:10 for more direction. She could study Church Fathers, St. Aquinas, St. Peter Damian, or Magisterial teaching of 1900 years.