Vatican City, Mar 23, 2018 / 05:00 am (CNA/EWTN News).- Cardinal John Tong Hon has voiced support for a proposed deal on the appointment of bishops between the Vatican and China, saying he believes the Chinese government has generally become more tolerant, and an accord would help bring further openness and unity to the Church.
Tong is the Bishop Emeritus of Hong Kong, and spoke at a March 22-23 conference titled “Christianity in the Chinese Society: Impact, Interaction and Inculturation” taking place at Rome’s Pontifical Gregorian University.
Tong is one of two Chinese cardinals, the other being his predecessor, Cardinal Joseph Zen. While Zen has consistently been an outspoken critic of the proposed deal, Hon holds a different opinion.
In an interview with a small number of journalists, one of which was CNA, Hon said opposition to the accord is “unreasonable,” because the deal aims at unity. He called the agreement “far-sighted” and said at times, sacrifice is necessary in order for Catholics to become “members of one family.”
The deal – which would allegedly follow the model of the Vatican’s agreement with Vietnam, allowing the Holy See to pick bishops from a selection of candidates proposed by the government – is rumored to be “imminent.”
In a recent blog post, Cardinal Zen indicated that the agreement could be signed as early as March 23 (tomorrow) or March 27. If the deal is reached, Zen said he would “retire in silence” and would “hide and pray,” but that he would not oppose the pope.
In his interview with journalists, Cardinal Hon said he didn’t want to speculate about when the deal might come, but said he was “optimistic” it would eventually happen.
Below are excerpts of Cardinal Hon’s conversation with journalists:
Q: This conference is addressing the presence of Christianity in China. From your perspective, what is the current situation for Christians there? Some say there is persecution and an increase in restrictions for religions, but others say the situation has improved. What is your take?
I am a Hong Kong citizen. Hong Kong belongs to one country, is a part of China, yet Hong Kong, after 1997, is one country run under two systems, meaning Hong Kong still continues to be a capitalistic administration, and China is under the socialist system for 50 years. So we are doing the same things as before. Regarding China, I am also a foreigner, so that means I’m not an insider. I can offer my impression with a limited knowledge of China…In a general picture I think China has already greatly improved, so sometimes you find this tightening in this part or that part, but China is huge. You cannot use this to describe…If we have a very far-sighted vision about China, I think China is [becoming] more civilized, closer to the outside world. And then I think the general situation, in the present, is better. Those would be my remarks.
Q: So your perception is that China is more open to religion, is more tolerant?
In the future also it should be, not the other way. Because the people can come out from China, now most of the people like to come to Hong Kong or outside of China for a week, so their eyes are opened after seeing the outside world. So they of course have higher expectations. And also the officials, knowing, they are not stupid, they know the expectations of most of the common people, and although on one hand they want to exercise their authority over the common people, but at the same time they have to compromise. So from time to time, sometimes [there’s] a tightening, but other times [there’s] a loosening policy. But in the long run China will be more and wider open, there is no other way. If I were the officials, I would do similar things. So I am optimistic.
Q: In your opening remarks you spoke about the importance of dialogue and communication between Chinese authorities and Christianity. This reminded me of your remarks in February about a deal between the Vatican and China on the appointment of bishops and allowing the Church to be registered in China. You said you were optimistic if it followed the Vietnamese model. Some say it won’t follow this model. Are you still optimistic?
Yes, I’m still optimistic, because I always, this is my belief, whatever is reasonable can last for a long time. Whatever is unreasonable will fade out or has to be changed. You can see from the whole of human history, even the history of China. Even Mao, Mao was so cruel, so strong, but finally…and also the cultural revolution created a lot of chaotic situations in China, but finally those situations have been changed. So there is no other way.
Q: So in this case ‘reasonable’ would be the deal, and ‘unreasonable’ would be against it?
Yes.
Q: A lot has been said in the media about your predecessor, Cardinal Zen, who has spoken out a lot against this deal. What is your opinion about this and what it says about the current dynamics in China?
This is a free world, everybody can express their own opinion. Everyone can use their own mind, their wisdom, to discern. So when you open your eyes and also open your ears, you can hear many, many different voices. So this is a free world. What can you say? We, as persons, we respect everybody as a person. So different opinions, up to your own wisdom to discern. That’s my [opinion], which I received from my teacher, it’s the lesson I learned.
Q: How is Pope Francis received in China? In the West he’s very popular even among non-Catholics. Is it the same in China?
Yes. Generally speaking, he’s loved by Catholics and non-Catholics.
Q: What’s the appeal?
He’s a humble person. The first thing is that he is really humble, and a humble person will be loved by many people. If you are proud you get a lot of enemies. This is also biblical teaching by our Lord Jesus. So we have to be humble. Jesus humbled himself and came down to earth and finally received crucifixion, suffering. So humility is important, that’s one thing. And second, he has a far-sighted vision. He’s not only seeing [now], but how to achieve the reign of God. The reign of God is to make humanity whole, to be one family, and we are all brothers and sisters, the whole world. Also through the negotiations promoted and advocated by the Second Vatican Council…Sometimes we can lose something so we can achieve friendship and set an example for all others and all other people, so finally we become friends, and then eventually we become all members of one family. At that time the reign of God will be implemented on earth…I was trained here 50 years ago at the Urbanianum. At that time the Second Vatican Council was being held, and I witnessed the grand closing ceremony. And right away I was ordained a priest with more than 60 classmates by Pope Paul VI. So that is what we were taught, and we have also what we were taught to believe in. So if you don’t believe that, that it’s only looking for [certain] things, that’s your business, that’s not my faith. And finally, we have to pray for the Church in China.
Q: People have been talking about a deal with China for years, and now it seems that is pretty sure…
I don’t want to make any guess, it’s up to God’s will.
Q: But if it does happen, is there something about Francis’ pontificate or diplomatic style that would allow the deal to happen? Is there something about the way he does diplomacy that would make the deal more likely than in the past?
If there’s any breakthrough, it’s God’s will, I don’t want to make any speculation. I’m not a prophet, I only follow our dogmatic teaching in the Church, and also the teaching of the constitutions issued by the Second Vatican Council. What I have learned in teaching in seminary, we pray for the Church in China, but I don’t want to make any speculations…during the year, almost three years ago, during the year of divine mercy, the Church in China, particularly, during that period, was also very happy to respond to the appeal made by the Holy Father. So it shows that they are very positive about the Holy Father because they follow the instructions given by the Holy Father.
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I think that, instead of singing hymns, we would have more success getting the congregation to participate if we brought soccer balls to Mass and kicked them up and down the aisles. And the parishes wouldn’t need to pay for a pipe organ and its maintenance, or any other keyboard or instrument, or a cantor or a music minister!
Sadly, I’m actually serious about this.
I am a pianist/organist who has played all my life since childhood in Protestant churches and in several Catholic parishes in my hometown. When I moved to a new Big City after my husband passed away, I assumed that these “City Folks” would be great singers and musicians, but they’re aren’t, and neither are the suburb or rural folks.
I don’t think anyone sings anymore except when they sing along with their popular music.
I think getting Catholics in the congregation to “sing out!” is like trying to train cats! (I love cats and have a cat of my own.) Protestants at least try to warble along with their Praise and Worship team, but many of them don’t sing, either.
And even the large Catholic churches have tiny choirs (and very few men!) compared to the numbers of people sitting in the pews! Shouldn’t a parish that has several thousand members have at least a hundred people singing the choir!
Catholic friends tell me, “I sing!” But do they, really? I LOVE TO SING, and often, people, especially the children, in my parish turn around to stare at me when I am singing in a full voice, on pitch, and often singing the alto part (which isn’t written in our “missalette” hymns–grrr!!!! None of the parts are written out. Apparently, the hymnals, with four-part music scores, are too expensive and I’ve also heard that they’re “too heavy”. Sigh.
Once (just once), I heard a gentleman behind me singing the melody in a beautiful baritone voice, and after Mass, I told him he was a good singer. He sighed and told me, “This parish used to have a schola that all us schoolboys were part of, and we sang Gregorian chant and Latin, as well as the hymns in parts, and we loved singing. But now…” and he sighed again.
I wasn’t surprised. Once in my home parish, when my husband was still alive, and our daughters were home from college, all four of us sang the Mass hymns, and we sang all the parts (for those Catholics who don’t know what “parts” are–soprano, alto, tenor, bass)–and all the people in front of us turned around and stared at us!
Sadly, my current 150-year-old church nave has absolutely perfect acoustics. What a shame that the congregation doesn’t sing! It especially grieves me when I see the children just standing there. Their parents don’t even open the missalette to read the words of the hymn and show them to their children but just seem to be waiting until the hymn is over and they can sit down again.
When my daughters were growing up, I used to have them stand on the pews, and I would hold the hymnals open for them when they were too small to hold them and sing to THEM (as well as to God!) during the hymns so that they would learn the melody and the words. Since I was one of the pianists, I would have the schedule of hymns in advance and would often teach them to my daughters at home so they would know them on Sunday.
Both of my daughters were good singers because I TAUGHT them to sing and taught them the hymns, beginning with singing to them when they were babies, teaching them fun children’s songs when they were toddlers, keeping them away from pop and country music until they were older, and teaching them other music skills as they grew up. One of my daughters makes her living as a stage manager–she got her first job as stage manager of a professional ballet company because she knew how to read music! My other daughter is in a medical career, but she cantors at her large parish, and still plays piano, violin, and guitar just to relax!
My grandson, who will turn 4 soon, has already “written” 2 songs (ha ha!) and he often sings in a very loud monotone, but he’s getting there! He definitely loves music!
Amazing how many adults don’t know how to read music these days! And it’s even more amazing that kids can play soccer, but can’t read music, sing in a head voice, or have never sung in a choir because THEIR PARISH SCHOOL DOESN’T OFFER MUSIC!!!, and if they did, the children would choose a sports elective instead of a music elective.
No WONDER Hollywood and much of the professional entertainment world is so atheistic these days! (There are notable exceptions.)
I really hope that this music ignorance and avoidance will change in Catholic parishes as more Protestants convert to Catholicism (like my family did). It’s a shame that we have to drive into the city to the Basilica to hear good music–but even then, the congregation doesn’t sing. I don’t think they know how to sing. I don’t think many Catholics know how to sing. It’s really sad, considering that Paul and Silas sang hymns when they were imprisoned in chains, and that as the Early Church martyrs were marched into the arena, they sang hymns. I guess we’ll kick that soccer ball around on our way to the lions.
Latin Mass scholas are still in operation . I used to sing in one and we have an all male schola at our local Latin Mass down the road.
You’re blessed!
We are blessed here indeed Mrs. Sharon.
If our TLM community can leave the conspiracy narratives alone and just focus on Our Lord and the Mass we’ll be great shape. I love the music but had to take a break from some of the craziness.
People who feel demeaned and disregarded by the shepherds can start listening to some weird stuff. Hopefully our new pope will make the TLM more widely available and things will get back to normal.
When you force people to worship in bunkers is it any wonder when they adopt a bunker mentality?
🙂
I am guessing the younger generations are generally not trained in music well. (Schools in our area have cut those programs so administrators can be hired and the IT departments can be upgraded). I know I am not well trained. As a child, I was partially hard of hearing due to allergies. I remember being given a pitch test in elementary school. I did not receive a good score, and consequently was not invited into (or allowed into) the elementary’s school music program, which meant I didn’t take band or orchestra in Junior high or high school.
I can read standard music notation in both treble, clef, and alto clef (due to private piano and guitar instruction), but if you asked me to sing without the actual notes being played, I could not do that.
A month ago I strained my vocal chords and soft palate trying to do a Good Friday chant with the parish. Our parish is most elderly, and the voices are not strong. A gentleman in the parish reminds of this every now and then. He, of course, is well trained musically with a very good voice.
I agree with you that many students bypass music electives in schools (both public and parochial schools, and also home schools), often so that they can concentrate on the much-touted STEM courses and their guarantee of a high-paying job, and of course, on sports (with the hope of their parents that their child will earn a college scholarship if they are good in their sport(s).
It’s a shame that “money” is the motivation behind interest in STEM subjects.
Home-schooled students generally are either placed in music lessons or local choirs by parents, or the parents teach the music, which can work well if the parent is musical, but badly if the parent has no idea what they are doing. Many homeschool co-ops hire a music teacher, but even in home schools, if there are “electives,” many of the children select either STEM classes or Physical Education classes, not music.
I can understand the lack of requirement for music education in high school, but there is absolutely no excuse, IMO, especially in Catholic and other Christian schools (Protestant) for not having music (and other arts) taught in elementary school from Kindergarten through at least the 5th grade, and ideally, into Middle School as the boys (and girls, too, to a lesser extent) experience puberty and the “change” in their voices.
What we are seeing in churches, IMO, is the result of no music education, or inadequate music education. E.g., in several of the schools in my former city, the schoolchildren were learning to sing “Hip Hop” music and rap music, and bypassing the traditional music education that teaches them how to read a music score and how to sing in parts (usually only 2 parts in 5th through 8th grades in part because most of the boys have unchanged voices or are beginning to experience the awkwardness of voice change).
Thankfully, there are areas of the U.S. that still value music education and offer various music opportunities in the community. E.g., in my hometown, there is a Music Academy where many children and teens (especially those who are home-schooled) learn to sing and also play various musical instruments. Also, there are local community choirs that children and/or teens can join. The problem with these is that they generally cost a lot of money, which means that many children and teens do not have the financial resources to access these sources of music education. There are scholarships available, but these are not abundant, and are generally awarded to promising students, not just children and teens who want to sing in a choir. Sometimes churches offer children’s and teen choirs–African American churches generally do this with great success, and speaking of that, has anyone noticed how many talented musical superstars are African American in the U.S.–and most of them will tell fans that they got their musical start in CHURCH!?
We are short-changing our children and teens by not offering children’s and teens choirs in our parishes–thank goodness, some parishes still give children and teens the opportunity to sing in a choir at the Masses, but many don’t. I am not a certified music teacher, but I’ve had a lot of experience with children and music and have also written children’s songs (not published). I’m also a very good accompanist (piano). There are a lot of people in churches and parishes who are capable of leading a children’s or even teen choir, even if the singers just sing in unison.
My personal opinion is that without children’s and teen choirs, we will continue to see Mass music decline in quality and participation. Some people mistakenly blame the “banal” or “heretical” songs in the missalettes, and although I agree that we need to take a serious look at our missalettes and eliminate quite a few of the hymns that have questionable words or awkward tunes (with large intervals which are difficult to sin), but the silence that occurs in the congregation during the Mass hymns has more to do with lack of ability to read a musical line and sing on pitch in a head voice (not an octave below the score that makes the singing “growly”!)–skills that most children and teens (and adults, too!) are generally capable of doing with a little instruction. Of course, although I hate to suggest it, but I also think many adults believe that the Mass music just slows the Mass down and prevents them from enjoying their Sunday off work, hence their willingness to attend a Mass that has no music at all.
Shame on us for neglecting the praise of our God in our singing and playing of musical instruments during Mass! Psalm 150–maybe it should become a “Project” for Catholic parishes in the U.S.A!
I’ve sung in choirs all my life and have never sung the Regina Coeli.
You can bet I’ve looked it up now!
Singing the Regina Caeli is like experiencing a bit of Heaven. The tone, the Latin, and knowing it’s honoring the Queen of Heaven adds that special ‘umph’ to it. Plus, the Regina Caeli takes the place of the Angelus during the Easter Season.
The Regina Coeli (Caeli?) takes the place of the Angelus during the Easter season? Didn’t know that either.
Still so much to learn, so little time!