Pope Francis waves to pilgrims gathered in St. Peter’s Square for his Wednesday general audience on May 8, 2024. (Credit: Vatican Media)
Rome Newsroom, Jun 4, 2024 / 13:52 pm (CNA).
Pope Francis has reportedly encouraged a 22-year-old gay man to continue to pursue a vocation to the priesthood after he was not accepted into a Catholic seminary.
According to the Italian newspaper Il Messaggero, the pope responded to an email from Lorenzo Michele Noè Caruso, telling him to “go ahead” with his vocation, just days after the Vatican issued an apology for the pontiff’s use of a slur in reference to seminarians who identify as gay.
The pope’s handwritten note was sent June 1 as an email attachment. According to news reports, it condemned clericalism and worldliness and said: “Jesus calls all, all.”
According to Il Messaggero, Pope Francis told the 22-year-old that “some people think of the Church as a customs house, and this is terrible. The Church should be open to everyone. Brother, go ahead with your vocation.”
Caruso told Il Messaggero that he had sent a lengthy email to Pope Francis on May 28 in which he wrote that he wanted to draw attention to his story and the stories of many who, “like me, live at the margins of the Church, often forced to hide themselves to be included by the community or forced to pay the high price of refusal for being sincere.”
The 22-year-old from La Spezia in northern Italy reportedly told the pope about his belief he has a calling to the Catholic priesthood and how he was not accepted into seminary after revealing his sexual identity. He also asked the Church to reconsider its prohibition on admitting homosexual people to the seminary as stated in a 2005 instruction from the Congregation for Catholic Education.
“This letter gave me hope,” Caruso said. “Now the seminary remains a not-dismissed dream.”
The pope, in his note, also said he was struck by an expression Caruso used in his own email: “toxic and elective clericalism.”
“It’s true!” Francis continued. “You know that clericalism is a scourge? It’s an ugly ‘worldliness.’”
He added that “worldliness is the worst thing that can happen to the Church, worse even than the era of concubine popes,” attributing the quote to “a great theologian,” by whom he likely meant Jesuit Father Henri de Lubac.
The pontiff has frequently quoted or paraphrased de Lubac on spiritual worldliness.
“My whole story,” Caruso said, “has been studded with these responses, when a religious person discovered my sexuality, no matter how much he had appreciated my person and my faith up to a minute before, he would retreat, saying things like, ‘There are so many ways to decline a vocation.’ I was effectively denied the possibility of having a priestly vocation. ‘Continue,’ urges Pope Francis.”
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Vatican City, May 4, 2017 / 10:47 am (CNA/EWTN News).- Pope Francis on Thursday approved decrees of the Congregation for the Causes of Saints advancing the causes for canonization of 12 individuals, including the American-born Capuchin Solanus Casey and the Vietnamese cardinal Francis Xavier Nguyen Van Thuan.
In his May 4 meeting with Cardinal Angelo Amato, prefect of the congregation, Pope Francis recognized a miracle attributed to the intercession of Venerable Solanus Casey, which allows for his beatification.
Venerable Casey was known for his great faith, attention to the sick, and ability as a spiritual counselor.
Born Bernard Casey on Nov. 25, 1870, he was the sixth child of 16 born to Irish immigrants in Wisconsin. At age 17 he left home to work at various jobs, including as a lumberjack, a hospital orderly, and a prison guard.
Reevaluating his life after witnessing a drunken sailor brutally stab a woman to death, he decided to act on a call he felt to enter the priesthood. Because of his lack of formal education, however, he struggled in the minor seminary, and was eventually encouraged to become a priest through a religious order rather than through the diocese.
So in 1898 he joined the Capuchin Franciscans in Detroit and after struggling through his studies, in 1904 was ordained a “sacerdos simplex” – a priest who can say Mass, but not publicly preach or hear confessions.
He was very close to the sick and was highly sought-after throughout his life, in part because of the many physical healings attributed to his blessings and intercession. He is also known for his fondness for playing the violin and singing, although he had a bad singing voice because of a childhood illness which damaged his vocal chords.
Even in his 70s, Fr. Solanus Casey remained very active, and would even join the younger religious men in a game of tennis or volleyball. He died from erysipelas, a skin disease, on July 31, 1957, at the age of 87.
Fr. Michael Sullivan, provincial minister of the Capuchin Franciscan Province of St. Joseph, said May 4 that “Long before we knew and loved Pope Francis, we had the example of Fr. Solanus who lived the Gospel of Mercy. Known for his compassion and simplicity, he drew many thousands to God.”
Archbishop Allen H. Vigneron of Detroit commented that “The beatification of Father Solanus Casey is an incomparable grace for the Church in the Archdiocese of Detroit and for the whole community of Southeast Michigan. He is an inspiration to all us Catholics – and to all – of the power of grace to transform one’s life.”
The Pope also recognized the heroic virtue of Cardinal Nguyen Van Thuan. Imprisoned for his faith in Vietnam for 13 years, nine of them in solitary confinement, he is now declared venerable, a significant step forward in his cause.
Cardinal Van Thuan was born in Vietnam in 1928. He was ordained a priest of the Vicariate Apostolic of Hue in 1953 and appointed Bishop of Nha Trang in 1967.
He was appointed Coadjutor Archbishop of Saigon in April 1975, six days before the city fell to the North Vietnamese army. Cardinal Van Thuan was imprisoned in a re-education camp by the communist government of Vietnam for 13 years, nine of them in solitary confinement.
While imprisoned he smuggled out messages written on scraps of paper that were copied by hand and circulated among the Vietnamese community, eventually being printed in The Road of Hope.
He also wrote prayers in prison, which were later published in Prayers of Hope. He was allowed no religious items, but after sympathetic guards smuggled in a piece of wood and some wire for him, he was able to craft a small crucifix.
After being released from prison, he spent three years under house arrest before being permitted to visit Rome in 1991. He was exiled from Vietnam from that point until early 2001, and he resigned as Saigon’s coadjutor archbishop in 1994 when he was appointed vice president of the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace. He became the council’s president in 1998.
In 2000 he preached the spiritual exercises for the Roman Curia, which were subsequently published as Testimony of Hope.
He was made a cardinal by St. John Paul II in 2001, and he died in Rome on Sept. 16, 2002, at the age of 74.
Three other causes were also approved for beatification Thursday: Venerable Maria of the Immaculate Conception, founder of the Daughters of Mary Immaculate (1789-1828); Venerable Clara Fey, founder of the Institute of the Sisters of the Poor Baby Jesus (1815-1894); and Venerable Catalina de Maria, founder of the Congregation of the Servant Sisters of the Most Sacred Heart of Jesus (1823-1896).
Pope Francis has also approved the declaration of the martyrdom of Servant of God Luciano Botovasoa, layman and father, of the Third Order of St. Francis, killed in hatred of the faith in Vohipeno, Madagascar on April 17, 1947.
Also recognized were the heroic virtues of the servants of God Cardinal Elia Dalla Costa of Florence (1872-1961); Giovanna Meneghini, founder of the congregation of the Ursuline Sisters of the Sacred Heart of Mary (1868-1918); Vincenza Cusmano, first superior general of the Congregation of the Poor Servants (1826-1894); Alessandro Nottegar, layman and father, founder of the Community of Regina Pacis (1943-1986); Edvige Carboni, laywoman (1880-1952); Maria Guadalupe Ortiz de Landázuri y Fernández de Heredia, laywoman of the Personal Prelature of Santa Croce and of Opus Dei (1916-1975).
Vatican City, Apr 11, 2020 / 03:30 pm (CNA).- Pope Francis urged Christians to be “messengers of life in a time of death” as he celebrated the Easter Vigil in a nearly empty St. Peter’s Basilica amid the coronavirus pandemic.
In his homily April 11, he said: “How beautiful it is to be Christians who offer consolation, who bear the burdens of others and who offer encouragement: messengers of life in a time of death!”
He continued: “Let us silence the cries of death, no more wars! May we stop the production and trade of weapons, since we need bread, not guns. Let the abortion and killing of innocent lives end.”
“May the hearts of those who have enough be open to filling the empty hands of those who do not have the bare necessities.”
With the Vatican under lockdown, the congregation consisted of only a small number of clergy and lay people, who stood spaced apart as a precaution against spreading COVID-19. Officials confirmed an eighth case of the disease among Vatican employees April 8, but have reported no deaths.
St. Peter’s, the largest church in the world, is normally packed for the Easter Vigil. This year, vast parts of the basilica were completely empty and silent. Microphones picked up the smallest sounds from the liturgy.
This year’s Easter Vigil liturgy was scaled back. The preparation of the Paschal candle was omitted due to “the health emergency in progress”, the Vatican said, as was the lighting of candles among the faithful.
Instead, the basilica was lit up gradually until it was fully illuminated at the Gloria, when the bells of St. Peter’s tolled. No baptisms took place, only a renewal of baptismal promises.
The pope celebrated the Vigil at the Altar of the Chair, which was flanked by the miraculous crucifix of San Marcello and the Byzantine icon of Mary, Salus Populi Romani.
In his homily, the 83-year-old pope noted that in St Matthew’s Gospel the women found Jesus’ tomb empty “after the Sabbath”.
“This is how the Gospel of this holy Vigil began: with the Sabbath,” he said. “It is the day of the Easter Triduum that we tend to neglect as we eagerly await the passage from Friday’s cross to Easter Sunday’s Alleluia. This year however, we are experiencing, more than ever, the great silence of Holy Saturday.”
“We can imagine ourselves in the position of the women on that day. They, like us, had before their eyes the drama of suffering, of an unexpected tragedy that happened all too suddenly. They had seen death and it weighed on their hearts.”
“Pain was mixed with fear: would they suffer the same fate as the Master? Then too there was fear about the future and all that would need to be rebuilt. A painful memory, a hope cut short. For them, as for us, it was the darkest hour.”
But the women did not allow themselves to be paralyzed, the pope observed.
“Jesus, like a seed buried in the ground, was about to make new life blossom in the world; and these women, by prayer and love, were helping to make that hope flower,” he said. “How many people, in these sad days, have done and are still doing what those women did, sowing seeds of hope! With small gestures of care, affection and prayer.”
The pope said that the Resurrection gave believers a fundamental right: “the right to hope”. This is not mere optimism, he explained, but a gift from heaven.
He then referred to signs currently displayed in windows throughout Italy which proclaim “Andrà tutto bene” (“All will be well”).
“Over these weeks, we have kept repeating, ‘All will be well’, clinging to the beauty of our humanity and allowing words of encouragement to rise up from our hearts,” he said.
“But as the days go by and fears grow, even the boldest hope can dissipate. Jesus’ hope is different. He plants in our hearts the conviction that God is able to make everything work unto good, because even from the grave he brings life.”
He urged listeners undergoing suffering not to give in to despair.
He said: “Dear sister, dear brother, even if in your heart you have buried hope, do not give up: God is greater. Darkness and death do not have the last word. Be strong, for with God nothing is lost!”
More than 107,000 people had died from COVID-19 worldwide as of April 11, according to the Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center.
Altar of the Chair in St. Peter’s Basilica, where Bernini’s gorgeous bronze monument to the Chair of Peter acts as a massive
bronze reliquary for the historic wooden chair. / Credit: Vatican Media
Vatican City, Nov 9, 2024 / 06:00 am (CNA).
For the first time in over a century, the historic Chair of St. Peter, a wooden throne symbolizing the pope’s magisterial authority, has been removed from its gilded bronze reliquary in St. Peter’s Basilica to be displayed for public veneration.
Pilgrims and visitors can now behold this storied relic directly in front of the basilica’s main altar, just above the tomb of St. Peter, where it will remain on display until Dec. 8, the solemnity of the Immaculate Conception.
The last major public viewing of the chair occurred in 1867, when Pope Pius IX exposed the Chair of Peter for the veneration of the faithful for 12 days on the 1,800th anniversary of the martyrdoms of St. Peter and St. Paul, according to Pietro Zander, head of the Necropolis and Artistic Heritage Section of the Vatican.
It was the first time that the centuries-old wooden throne had been exhibited to the public since 1666 when it was first encased within Gian Lorenzo Bernini’s monumental bronze sculpture under the stained-glass Dove of the Holy Spirit window at the basilica’s apse.
The historic wooden Chair of St. Peter as it is currently on display in St. Peter’s Basilica. Credit: Courtney Mares/CNA
Formally known as the Cathedra Sancti Petri Apostoli, or more simply as Cathedra Petri, the chair has held a revered place in Catholic tradition over the centuries, representing papal authority from St. Peter to the present.
“The chair is meant to be understood as the teacher’s ‘cathedra,’” art historian Elizabeth Lev told CNA. “It symbolizes the pope’s duty to hand down the teaching of Christ from generation to generation.”
“It’s antiquity [ninth century] speaks to a papacy that has endured through the ages — from St. Peter who governed a church on the run trying to evangelize with the might of the Roman Empire trying to shut him down, to the establishment of the Catholic Church and its setting down of roots in the Eternal City, to our 266th successor of St. Peter, Pope Francis,” she explained.
Pope Francis venerates the Chair of St. Peter at the end of the closing Mass of the Synod on Synodality on Oct. 27, 2024, the first day the chair was displayed for public veneration. Credit: Vatican Media
A storied history
The wooden chair itself is steeped in history. According to the Vatican, the wooden seat was likely given by the Holy Roman Emperor Charles the Bald to Pope John VIII in A.D. 875 for the emperor’s Christmas coronation in the old St. Peter’s Basilica. A depiction of the emperor appears on the crossbeam of the chair, and its ivory panels illustrate the labors of Hercules along with other scenes from Greek mythology.
The informational sign near the chair in St. Peter’s Basilica informs visitors that “shortly after the year 1000, the Cathedra Petri began to be venerated as a relic of the seat used by the apostle Peter when he preached the Gospel first in Antioch and then in Rome.”
The Fabric of St. Peter, the organization responsible for the basilica’s upkeep, maintains that “it cannot be ruled out that this ninth-century imperial seat may have later incorporated the panel depicting the labors of Hercules, which perhaps originally belonged to an earlier and more ancient papal seat.”
Before returning the chair to its place within Bernini’s monumental reliquary, Vatican experts will conduct a series of diagnostic tests with the Vatican Museums’ Cabinet of Scientific Research. The ancient seat was last removed and studied from 1969 to 1974 under Pope Paul VI but was not shown to the public.
Closer details can be seen of the historic relic of the Chair of St. Peter. For the first time in over a century, the wooden throne symbolizing the pope’s magisterial authority has been removed from its gilded bronze reliquary in St. Peter’s Basilica to be displayed for public veneration. Credit: Daniel Ibanez
The recent restoration of Bernini’s works in the basilica, funded by the Knights of Columbus in preparation for the Catholic Church’s 2025 Jubilee Year, made it possible for the chair to be moved from the bronze sculpture in August.
Pope Francis got a sneak peak of the relic in early October and a photo of the moment — showing him sitting in a wheelchair before the Chair of St. Peter — quickly went viral. Afterward, the pope requested that the relic be displayed for public veneration.
Francis ultimately decided that the Chair of St. Peter — a symbol of the Church’s unity under the instruction of Christ — would be unveiled for the public at the closing Mass for the Synod on Synodality.
“Pope Francis has been exceptionally generous to the faithful about displaying relics,” Lev said. “He brought out the bones of St. Peter shortly after his election, he had the Shroud of Turin on view in 2015, and now he has taken the Chair of Peter out for veneration in the basilica.”
“In our virtual age, where much confusion reigns between what is real and what is not, Pope Francis has encouraged us to come face to face with these ancient witnesses of our faith and our traditions.”
Pope Francis venerates the Chair of St. Peter at the end of the closing Mass of the Synod on Synodality on Oct. 27, 2024, in Rome. Credit: Vatican Media
Feast of the Chair of St. Peter
The Feast of the Chair of St. Peter, celebrated each year on Feb. 22, dates back to the fourth century. St. Jerome (A.D. 347–420) spoke of his respect for the “Chair of Peter,” writing in a letter: “I follow no leader save Christ, so I enter into communion with … the Chair of Peter, for this I know is the rock upon which the Church is built.”
As Pope Benedict XVI explained in a 2006 catechesis: “‘Cathedra’ literally means the established seat of the bishop, placed in the mother church of a diocese, which for this reason is known as a ‘cathedral.”
“It is the symbol of the bishop’s authority and in particular, of his ‘magisterium,’ that is, the evangelical teaching which, as a successor of the apostles, he is called to safeguard and to transmit to the Christian community,” he said.
When a bishop takes possession of the particular Church that has been entrusted to him, he sits on the cathedra, Benedict explained: “From this seat, as teacher and pastor, he will guide the journey of the faithful in faith, hope, and charity.”
“The Church’s first ‘seat’ was the upper room, and it is likely that a special place was reserved for Simon Peter in that room where Mary, mother of Jesus, also prayed with the disciples,” he added.
Benedict XVI described Peter’s ministry as a journey from Jerusalem to Antioch, where he served as bishop, and ultimately to Rome. He noted that the See of Rome, where Peter ultimately “ended his race at the service of the Gospel with martyrdom,” became recognized as the seat of his successors, with the cathedra representing the mission entrusted to Peter by Christ.
“So it is that the See of Rome, which had received the greatest of honors, also has the honor that Christ entrusted to Peter of being at the service of all the particular Churches for the edification and unity of the entire people of God,” he said.
The Altar of the Chair in St. Peter’s Basilica, where Bernini’s bronze monument to the Chair of Peter acts as a massive bronze reliquary for the historic wooden chair. Credit: Vatican Media
Bernini’s Baroque masterpiece
Bernini’s monumental reliquary for the chair, commissioned by Pope Alexander VII and completed in 1666, is one of the most iconic artworks in St. Peter’s Basilica. Bernini encased the wooden relic within a bronze-gilded throne, dramatically raised and crowned by a stained-glass depiction of the Holy Spirit, symbolized as a dove, surrounded by sculpted angels.
The bronze throne is supported by massive statues of four doctors of the Church — two from the West, St. Augustine and St. Ambrose, and two from the East, St. John Chrysostom and St. Athanasius — symbolizing the unity of the Church through the ages, bringing together the teachings of both the Latin and Greek Church Fathers. And at the top of the throne, cherubs hold up a papal tiara and keys symbolizing papal authority.
On the chair itself, there are three gold bas-reliefs representing the Gospel episodes of the consignment of the keys (Matthew 16:19), “feed my sheep” (John 21:17), and the washing of the feet (John 13:1-17).
The ongoing restoration of Bernini’s monument at the Altar of the Chair, along with the recently finished restoration of the baldacchino, is significant not only in light of the 2025 Jubilee Year but also the upcoming 400th anniversary of the consecration of the current St. Peter’s Basilica in 2026.
“Celebrating the ‘Chair’ of Peter,” Benedict XVI said, “means attributing a strong spiritual significance to it and recognizing it as a privileged sign of the love of God, the eternal Good Shepherd, who wanted to gather his whole Church and lead her on the path of salvation.”
Yet, dear ‘logboom’, senior Catholics have not been speechless but have been rebuking PF for years & years. E.G. –
April 30, 2019 (LifeSiteNews) – Prominent clergymen and scholars including Fr. Aidan Nichols, one of the best-known theologians in the English-speaking world, have issued an open letter accusing Pope Francis of committing heresy. They ask the bishops of the Catholic Church, to whom the open letter is addressed, to: “take the steps necessary to deal with the grave situation” of a pope committing this crime.
The authors base their charge of heresy on the manifold manifestations of Pope Francis’ embrace of positions contrary to the faith and his dubious support of prelates who in their lives have shown themselves to have a clear disrespect for the Church’s faith and morals.
“We take this measure as a last resort to respond to the accumulating harm caused by Pope Francis’s words and actions over several years, which have given rise to one of the worst crises in the history of the Catholic Church,” the authors state. The open letter is available in Dutch, Italian, German, French, and Spanish.
Among the signatories are well-respected scholars such as Father Thomas Crean, Fr. John Hunwicke, Professor John Rist, Dr. Anna Silvas, Professor Claudio Pierantoni, Dr. Peter Kwasniewski, and Dr. John Lamont. The text is dated “Easter Week” and appears on the traditional Feast Day of St. Catherine of Siena, a saint who counseled and admonished several popes in her time.
The 20-page document is a follow-up to the 2017 Filial Correction of Pope Francis that was signed originally by 62 scholars and which stated that the Pope has “effectively upheld 7 heretical positions about marriage, the moral life, and the reception of the sacraments, and has caused these heretical opinions to spread in the Catholic Church,” especially in light of his 2016 exhortation Amoris Laetitia.
The authors of the open letter state in a summary of their letter (read below) that it has now become clear that Pope Francis is aware of his own positions contrary to the faith and that the time has come to go a “stage further” by claiming that Pope Francis is “guilty of the crime of heresy.”
“We limit ourselves to accusing him of heresy on occasions where he has publicly denied truths of the faith, and then consistently acted in a way that demonstrates that he disbelieves these truths that he has publicly denied,” the authors state.
They clarify that they are not claiming Pope Francis has: “denied truths of the faith in pronouncements that satisfy the conditions for an infallible papal teaching.”
“We assert that this would be impossible, since it would be incompatible with the guidance given to the Church by the Holy Spirit,” they state.
In light of this situation, the authors call upon the bishops of the Church to take action since a: “heretical papacy may not be tolerated or dissimulated to avoid a worse evil.”
For this reason, the authors: “respectfully request the bishops of the Church to investigate the accusations contained in the letter, so that if they judge them to be well founded they may free the Church from her present distress, in accordance with the hallowed adage, Salus animarum prima lex (‘the salvation of souls is the highest law’). The bishops can do this, the writers suggest: “by admonishing Pope Francis to reject these heresies, and if he should persistently refuse, by declaring that he has freely deprived himself of the papacy.”
May 1, 2019 update: 12 more names of leading Catholics have been added to list of signers of the open letter, bringing total up to 31.
Very dangerous, evil and demonic decision! 😰 He proclaim not the gospel of Jesus Christ, instead he introduces another Christ, another Gospel, another spirit, another Church!! Read 2 Cori 11.4. That is what is happening through him..
A different Jesus who we have never heard of . . .
A different spirit who we have not received . . .
A different gospel that none of us accepted . . .
Out of the darkness comes this new-fangled, Bergoglian Anti-Apostolic Church, in short: the BAAL church; intended to overturn & evict our venerable Holy Catholic Apostlic Church.
A different Jesus who we have never heard of . . .
A different spirit who we have not received . . .
A different gospel that none of us accepted . . .
Undeceived by PF’s smoke-screen of: “Now you see me, now you don’t!” Catholics everywhere are waking up to the deviousness of this new-fangled, ‘Bergoglian Anti-Apostolic [BAAL] Church’, clearly intended to overturn & evict the godly tennets of our venerable Holy Catholic Apostolic Church.
Where in the gospel are non practicing homosexual oriented people barred from positions in the Church. Paul makes references to moral requirements but says nothing about one living as chaste homosexual. Ones orientation is not a sin and it doesn’t bar one from exemplary moral conduct or preclude one from being a saint. If this is so, why not a priest?
For the same reason we don’t allow pedophiles who aren’t acting out to be around children. It’s simply too risky and dangerous. Leaders should be above reproach.
When an “orientation” is acquired behavior as the result of habitualized sin, secular mythology of innocence notwithstanding, it says a lot about weaknesses of character that would warrant serious negative consideration.
Many people still completely miss the boat on this- it’s because SSA is a disorder of the person, regardless of whether they act on it or not. This is to say that it’s very difficult for such a person to be chaste, in what that technically means, which is not abstinence, which seems to be meaning in the question and is most often meant. Thus the issue is also not really whether they can be celibate or have “mastered their predisposition,” in the words of Mr. Beaulieu below. (How could one truly “master” disorder, which would arguably require healing from it, in which case they may no longer have SSA. Otherwise it may be largely physical abstention, which still always provides a struggle within the person.) If one also holds that SSA is more specifically a psychic disorder/mental illness- which all the evidence still points to- this is even more crucial. (There is still zero indication people are “born that way,” and this is now openly contradicted by transgender nonsense, which says there is no biological basis for our sexuality & that someone can change it through will power and thought.) Why would you even risk making someone a priest who may have a psychic disorder? Furthermore, it is well attested that those with SSA, even if one would argue they are born that way, most often suffer from various other psycho-emotional problems and disorders- depression, narcissism, tend to have high rates of substance abuse, suicide, etc. Again, why take a risk? One can also highlight some possible causes of SSA, with having been sexually abused/encroached upon while young as one of the most common. Such a person will have serious trauma, while this often leads them to commit such behavior themselves. This is one reason why homosexual men, including abusive clergy, comprise a very disproportionate amount of those who prey upon minors. Bishops especially who think ordaining those with SSA is not necessarily a problem, seem to have no clue that such factors need to be considered.
The lack of masculinity of men with SSA is also an issue, making them unsuitable to act in persona cristi. It also makes them of weak character, providing difficulty to speak and act forcibly about Church teaching or enact discipline. There is perhaps little doubt one reason behind the failure of some bishops and priests to defend Church teaching- especially about sexuality- or enact discipline, fail to reign in abusive priests, is because they have SSA. It may also actively lead them to propagate error, to rationalize their own SSA. One can think of the likes of Fr. James Martin or Bishop John Stowe here.
Is there any line in the questionnaire for admission that asks, “are you attracted to male or female”?
Unless one acts out on it or declares it publicly, how is a (chaste) homosexual (merely by orientation) determined and then barred from the seminary? Doesn’t make sense.
Candidates for seminary routinely participate in a ‘discernment’ that continues during seminary years. A spiritual director typically assists the candidate in assessing his suitability.
Church teaching is that homosexual orientation (even if in thought rather than act) is a DISORDERED INCLINATION. A man who would withhold his thoughts or inclinations in truthful open manifest discussion with his spiritual director hides the truth of his very self in the discernment process. He is presenting a false picture to the director, to the Church, and his very self. Such a man has no true ‘call’ from the Lord to the priesthood. As such, he is not a suitable candidate for the priesthood.
First, if Caruso’s long letter to Pope Francis disclosed that he (himself) is entirely celibate and has mastered his predisposition, then none of this is really news. But such does not seem to be the case; the exchange almost sounds staged or at least predictably and cleverly timed. It’s hard to tell, again.
Second, a recent reminiscence on the longer trend, from Benedict XVI:
“Until the Second Vatican Council, Catholic moral theology was broadly founded on natural law, with Sacred Scripture cited only for background or substantiation. In the council’s struggle for a new understanding of revelation, the natural law option was almost completely set aside, and a moral theology based entirely on the Bible was demanded” (“The Church and the Scandal of Sexual Abuse,” in “What is Christianity [?]: The Last Writings,” Ignatius, 2023, p. 180).
Third, Benedict adds elsewhere about the Bible, that in the Lutheran bible the word for the universal and Eucharistic “Church” is almost completely replaced by the local “community”—as reduced from the sacramental to simply an office for bottoms-up reading clubs. So, what does it mean, now, when such ecclesial “communities” share the same terminology as the politicized new religion of the LGBTQ “community?” And with the language of gesture, signaling and private notes being passed in school?
In small half-steps, rather than the Church being welcoming, is the Church being annexed?
The pope’s informal, spontaneous, and handwritten note lends itself to a “plausible deniability” of sorts—a very familiar technique imported from corporate boardrooms (the old secular equivalent to the new clericalism!)—the same as informal and spontaneous semi-blessings of “couples” under Fiducia Supplicans.
Just some surely random stuff, here; and who am I to judge?
God is the source of both natural law (because He is the author of all of creation) and the Bible. Therefore they will not contradict… if we understand them both correctly.
There are differences. The homosexual disorder whether innate in the person or cultivated, is not to be preferred in the person but must actively be displaced. Whereas the natural sexual constitution is meant to be preserved in stable disposition.
Second “differentiation” is to do with dimension. Stop trying to justify anything homosexual whether as it stands on its own or by “comparisons” and “contrasts” with other conditions or disorders.
Yes, it’s different but there are similarities. Every sin resembles another in a certain way.
Not sure how your meaning might be misinterpreted by some…
So, yes and no. “Yes,” there is no difference, in that heterosexual immorality, like much else, also violates human nature and moral absolutes (as explained in the Catechism and more explicitly in Veritatis Splendor). But, “no,” if the misinterpretation–by some readers–might be that binary sexual intercourse (“outside of one’s marriage”) and homosexual mechanics (even redefining “marriage”) are indifferently equivalent….
Instead, there’s this address from Cardinal Erdo as the relator to the 1995 session on the Synod on the Family:
“‘There are absolutely no grounds for considering homosexual unions to be in any way similar or even remotely analogous to God’s plan for marriage and family.’….” (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Considerations Regarding Proposals to Give Legal Recognition to Unions Between Homosexual Persons, 4, Instrumentum Laboris 130). See Section III.3: https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/32772/full-text-of-cardinal-erdos-introductory-report-for-the-synod-on-the-family
An address well worth reading again. And, perhaps, in the decade or two ahead, we might even see an inspired uptick in single-hearted vocations to the celibate priesthood and restoration of equally single-hearted vocations to faithful marriage and families, both.
And now the appointment of three blind trapeze artists to the swinging Dicastery for the Doctrine of the Faith.
Out with nuptial, sacramental imagery and traditional Church wisdom.
In with inner conflict, imprecise speech (“all” as in women, e.g.?), misplaced ecclesial “clericalism” and the “tenderness” that “leads to the gas chamber” (Flannery O’Connor).
Advantage to religious vows and ordination should be barred to those who are afflicted with evil tendencies to homosexuality or pederasty, since for them the common life and the priestly ministry would constitute serious dangers.
I actually proposed betting odds with several very orthodox Catholic friends of mine regarding how long the other side of his Peronism would take to show up after his crude but appropriate comment on the condition of Italian seminaries. I won. They thought it would take a couple of months. I said less than one month. They owe me a beer.
Confusion is the consistent product of the words of pope Francis. He beats the drum of anti-clericalism to placate the desire for a host of other sins. There is the pose of humility and holiness, but it is tarnished by the support for those behaviors God has condemned from the beginning.
I pray for him.
Once again we confront Jorge Mario Bergoglio performing what has become a wearisome spectacle that some have called his “Peronist” maneuver; namely, saying one thing which is Catholic and actually doing its opposite which is not only non-Catholic but also morally evil. What surprises me after all this time is that those in the Church observing this resolutely wish it away and refuse to answer the unavoidable questions: “Is Bergoglio a homosexual?”, “Is Bergoglio a heretic?”, and “Is Bergoglio an apostate?”
He has reportedly used gutter language for gays frequently, and always has been keen for gossip on moral failings of other churchmen, where he then surrounds himself with these failures, them afraid of exposure, while he protects them as long as possible, which pattern has repeated numerous times in this pontificate….he uses others for power…his latest word games only more of same, from which he has drawn support from both sides…while always plausible deniability either direction, only his official acts pointing the way of his true agenda, which ain’t good.
Dear Paul – a heartfelt question, so many good Catholics want answered.
Yet, those in authority [cardinals, archbishops, bishops, etc.] have long known that PF is of the anti-Apostolic, anything goes, worldly libertine faction in our Church.
Sadly, most of them are mesmerized and reduced to a zombi-like state of aquiescence. This is because by years of managerial prioritizing they have separated themselves from the faithful flock of Catholics who are following our LORD Jesus Christ.
Lets keep praying for Pope Francis and all the leaders to have a life-changing ‘Damascus Road’ encounter with King Jesus Christ.
Always in the love of The Lamb of GOD; blessings from marty
I wonder how the clergy who as Bishop of Burnie Airies in Argentina witnessed the Eucharist Miracle cd dare to contempt the teaching of the Bible. Very soon we shall hear another un-Godly preaching like saying “A poor person can steal from the rich to have his expenses fulfilled!” We should pray to the Catholic church as it has become a laughingstock from the Moslems and other Abrahamic religions.
Dear ‘brineyman’ & dear ‘DanM’ – on this occasion it seems you both miss the target.
God in Christ Jesus instructs us to avoid judging by a person’s appearance and to focus on the fruits of their life.
As amply demonstrated in this & many other articles over the last 6 years and in the current string of learned comments, our current pope looks good, speaks good, and has produced an unprecedented crop of toxic fruit.
No one who cares about the salavtion of souls should be embarassed to openly rebuke him for his bad fruit. It is responsible love not pride to render that service.
Being one in The Body of Christ & one in the Holy Spirit of GOD, it is our meritorious duty to humbly proclaim the truth, without fear or favor.
Catholics who remain silent in the face of anti-Apostolic teachings & actions are sinning because they are passive accomplices of wrong.
Always seeking to hear & lovingly follow King Jesus Christ; blessings from marty
The problem is language or misuse of it.
A man isn’t called a philanderer if he has an inclination to look at another woman not his wife, but fights it and resists.
The same should be for Lorenzo he shouldn’t be barred from the priesthood in the same way if he can bridle his instincts and look to God.
The Pope is right, the priesthood should be open to all dispositions of sin, the challenge surely then for all is to double down on the narrow path.
Where it’s unclear is if Lorenzo has professed his rejection of sin, vs. the culture’s language (which is completely wrong and the church and all should stand against) that “I was born this way”. Again, a man might be born in such a way as to have feelings towards another woman not his wife, but the church and Christ set a higher standard for all.
Homosexual inclinations are not an instinct. They are intrinsically disordered desires that result from deep and unhealed wounds, quite distinct from the wound of original sin that we all share. Those wounds have wide-ranging effects well beyond disordered sexual desires, which make it a bad idea to put such people into the more difficult life of a priest (more difficult in part because demons target priests more than laity) and also to expect them to be capable of behaving like a father to so many different people.
The idea that they were “born this way” is nonsense. What is not nonsense is that their brains are distinctly, physically different. Unhealed childhood trauma or neglect will do that.
I’m sharing the thoughts of a theologian I highly respect, which I believe summarize what we should consider about the papal office (even though expressed five years ago, I still consider these considerations valid)
“The Pope is surrounded by impostors – those whom Cardinal Mueller calls the ‘magic circle’ – and who are more traditionally called ‘courtiers,’ partly because he seeks them out and partly because they attempt the mad endeavor of establishing modernism in the Holy See, in accordance with the wishes of the famous modernist Ernesto Buonaiuti at the beginning of the last century.
However, despite the machinations of the modernists, the Pope, when moved by the Spirit to infallibly teach some Catholic truth, cannot resist the sweet and strong impulse of the Spirit, which keeps him from error, because the Spirit itself infallibly moves the Pope’s will to desire to speak the truth. No Pope ever intends to deceive the faithful in matters of faith. It is blasphemy to even think so.
Therefore, no Pope, thanks to the gift of the Petrine ministry, can ever wish to renounce, at the appropriate time, his infallibility, not out of negligence or false humility, but precisely in obedience to his duty to confirm the brethren in the truth of faith. The Holy Spirit prevents him from sinning in faith without forcing him, but for the good of the Church. A Pope can have all the vices, but not that of unbelief, heresy, or apostasy. Pope Francis is not without sins, but in matters of faith, he cannot be wrong. Let us trust him and try to understand him even when he is unclear or ambiguous. Let us criticize him on everything, but not on matters of faith. Above all, let us help him in guiding the Church and pray for him.”
That “theologian” is absurdly wrong. A pope can even be an atheist, although, like most atheists, not likely with a conscious awareness that his beliefs are atheistic.
In truth, among the traditionalists, there are some honest but confused or scandalized souls who listen to this theologian when he shows them that the Pope does not contradict Tradition at all, but rather may be lacking in pastoral care or moral conduct. Meanwhile, there are other rancorous, stubborn, and presumptuous spirits who, seeing that this theologian criticizes the Pope, want to drag him into their extremism or want him to consent to their insults against the Pope. To this, he responds with reproaches, even to the point of breaking off the conversation if necessary, while I only know how to pray (and obviously not even very well!).
As usual, you are defending the indefensible and committing a grave sin in the process. You should not be professing faith and simultaneously defending the pope’s error here. A gay man should be firmly discouraged from seeking the priesthood and any application to seminary should be rejected on that basis.
Paolo,
One key distinction is between the pope’s adherence to doctrine versus his errors or worse in governance, which only enable or surely aid and abet the prevailing agenda of the LGBTQ religion.
Another key distinction in “papal infallibility” is that this term refers broadly to the Church indwelled by the Holy Spirit and, therefore, to papal definitions–and not to the pope as a person. The pope is not a prophet in receipt of a blank check for his private use. A fine line, here, subject to convenient day-to-day ambiguity. Here’s the definition as precisely stated at the First Vatican Council:
“The Roman Pontiff when he speaks ex cathedra, that is, when exercising the office of pastor and teacher of all Christians, he defines [!] with his supreme authority a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, through the divine assistance promised to him in St. Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the divine Redeemer willed his Church [!] to be endowed in defining doctrine concerning faith and morals: and therefore such definitions [!] of the Roman Pontiff are irreformable of themselves (and not from the consent of the Church).”
So, the exact meaning of “papal infallibility” where there’s nothing about photo-ops, or non-verbal signaling, or appointments, disappointments and exiles, or name calling, or a long pattern of seemingly off-the-wall memes floated on airplanes, or attributed and uncorrected and broadcast by atheist journalists, secularist nomads, and media talking heads, or about Vatican Garden parties for Pachamama idols. . . .or about popolatry.
A somewhat artless track record!
The constructive criticism is not about “faith;” instead maybe this: “Art is like morals [and governance?], a line has to be drawn somewhere” (G.K. Chesterton).
A large number of comments reveal an acceptance of homosexuality usually conditioned by willingness to live a chaste life, others make no mention. Although the Pope’s response for an admitted homosexual to continue toward the priesthood is a message with far reaching implications. It affirms that to be, to consider, to choose to be homosexual is acceptable for the Church whether priest or layman. Not that it is simply tolerable, but that it is now universally accepted as a moral good.
That informal position by Pope Francis gives license to everyone to follow disordered thoughts regarding their sexual behavior at least insofar as preference. It informally [as distinct from a formal ex cathedra pronouncement] declares what the Church formally declares a moral disorder is not a moral disorder. It affirms the positions of Cardinals McElroy, Hollerich, and Fr James Martin. Although informal it’s the most sweeping repudiation of perennial Church doctrine on moral behavior in the history of Catholicism.
Fr. they also impute and sometimes make it explicit that those who stand against their disordered inclinations/appetites, etc., are the disordered category. That that standing against is a disorder. It adds to their error yet they try to make it seem a virtue.
Thank you. Excellent point Elias. Some argue only an inclination. An inclination is a natural appetite or desire directed by the will. Sin is the willful privation of direction to a due end. We can redirect our natural desires to a sinful end.
To give further account to “We can redirect our natural desires to a sinful end”, the Catechism states that the same sex inclination is not, of itself sinful. Although that may be true in some instances. Not all [based on God’s formation of the human person male and female with natural desires consistent with their sex]. We can willfully direct our desires toward a disordered end as in what’s vaguely described same sex attraction. As if that sensual desire is natural. That is putatively true in rare cases, when there is an ‘accident’ in nature, some physical impediment. Otherwise the same sex inclination is elective, an acquired behavior. There often are socio psychological dynamics that influence the attraction, which to degrees may mitigate culpability for the attraction. However, the same sex act in each and every instance as the Catechism teaches is sinful.
Fr. just found your note. Your points speak to James Connor and David among others. We know that the baptized can suffer the lingering effects of Original Sin. This is getting lost everywhere as simultaneous argumentation from all sides baptized and not baptized swamps the issues; where even the baptized add confusion. I don’t mean to be “over-critical” on them.
Don’t mean to lecture to Fr. only try to express what appears to be involved. Briefly with 2 points. 1. All kinds of motions can be mixed into or mixed up with Original Sin and its consequent impact before the will acts and after the will has acted. 2. The monopolizing of the topic by unbelievers, secularity, disbelief and false justice, is the work of Satan.
Arn’t we all born with moral disorders having original sin? We all have to deal with it differently.
No James Connor, we have to respond to the grace of God.
But incidentally, your adverbial “differently” confounds your question on Original Sin. You landed your frisbee into electrical wires there expecting me to run into them and get it for you; high tension, but I didn’t.
No James, original sin does not imply predestination for sin. And the intrinsic willful moral corruption of homosexuality is made clear by how the behavior correlates with affectations of a refusal to fully grow up, an obsessive pursuit of comfort, the retaining of children’s toys and attire, etc. And an evil mindset creates a near unanimous support for abortion among gays despite not deriving any personal convenience.
The point is that homosexuals do not accept it or speak of it as a “moral disorder.” Quite the contrary, they embrace it as a “gift,” a God-given “identity.” Just imagine a serial adulterer talking about his moral failings as an “identity.” Complete nonsense.
“Moral disorders”? Or, rather only an “inclination” to possibly choose and act upon such disorders.
So, none of us is totally depraved (the false premise of Martin Luther), but our created-good human nature is now marred by an inclination. A critical distinction, this, leaving room for free will…
And, a distinction that still required clarification (in defense of human nature) even after the Lutheran/Catholic Joint Declaration of Justification (1999). Readers can notice that the brief Preface reads in part, “The solemn confirmation of this Joint Declaration on 31 October 1999 in Augsburg, by means of the Official Common Statement with its ANNEX [!], represents an ecumenical event of historical significance.”
The integral ANNEX provides the cleverly-blurred and yet irreducible distinction between salvation by grace alone (elsewhere verbalized, in words attributed to Luther, that we remain as “dung covered with snow”), versus the Catholic doctrine that fallen man is not totally depraved, but rather suffers only from concupiscence—the tendency toward sin—and is free. The five-page Annex reads in part:
“The concept of ‘concupiscence’ is used in different senses on the Catholic and Lutheran sides. In the Lutheran Confessional writings ‘concupiscence’ is understood as the self-seeking desire of the human being, which in light of the law, spiritually understood, is regarded as sin [!]. In the Catholic understanding concupiscence is an inclination [!], remaining in human beings even after baptism, which comes from sin and presses toward sin [….]”
The Preface explains that the Declaration is to be read in conjunction with this clarification, and not without it (omitted in Lutheran versions and by aligned gender-theory ideology). This distinction in defense of the human person refutes the sloppy thinking of der Synodal Weg, holding instead that the homosexual inclination by itself (like all such inclinations) is not a sin, but that it is an objective evil to be resisted with the aid of grace from beyond ourselves—as are all other temptations of whatever stripe.
Then they wonder why we have good people leaving the Catholic Faith… Homosexuals are on the move and want every possible way they can to get into the church and all areas of society–look at all the Gay Pride parades and Drag Queen events. No knowing homosexual should be allowed to become clergy. Period!
Same as above post, Francis fancies himself an unpredictable Machiavellian/Peronist who knows the way to maintain power is to be unpredictable to friends and foes alike. Folk trying to shoehorn him into rational or even Catholic patterns will always be disappointed. He has reversed decisions dear to him, purely because the decisions leaked and spoiled his suprise. The only thing predictable was his about-face.
Gays don’t belong in the priesthood. The church sex abuse issue was overwhelmingly male priest to male seminarian or male child. These actions have served to bankrupt several dioceses and seriously impacted the ability of the church to function. Encouraging men with a serious emotional problem such as homosexuality to enter the priesthood seems like an obviously poor decision. It is clear by now that this pope has a conflicted idea of this issue. Lets hope the next Pope has appropriate priorities where homosexuality is concerned.
The mere fact that this young man prattles on and on about “sexual orientation” (which does not exist), instead of recognizing temptation to sin and the need to resist it, demonstrates clearly that he has no vocation. He would be a disaster in many functions a priest must exercise.
I suggest to Lorenzo Michele Noè Caruso, knock any jesuit organization door. They will welcome him with open arms. He is recommended by the higest jusuit at this right moment.
The logic of our current pontiff that allows for a homosexual to enter a seminary would seem also to allow for a straight male to join a monastery of straight females, or for a straight female to join a monastery of straight males. I suspect that our pontiff doesn’t seem to think that sexual lust or behavior–whether it be sodomy, fornication, or masturbation—would interfere with the formation in the Spirit, let alone thinking they are serious sins. It is better to believe his predecessor, St Peter, in his second letter (2Peter 2) who strongly warns against lust and the sins of the flesh.
I really think Pope Francis is right when he decries clericalism within the Church because what he actually means when he criticizes it as “worldly” is that it’s the “cliquish” nature of clericalism that is worldly as it’s built on an exclusivistic snobbery which is at loggerheads with the central message of the Gospel anyhow. I’m simply calling Pope Francis right for condemning clericalism or “the snobbery of officialdom”.
As regards him encouraging Lorenzo Carouso in discerning his vocation, Pope Francis’ position is more along the lines of guiding this man to continue to pray into the issue of his discipleship irrespective of the fact Lorenzo is struggling with sexual orientation issues. And it is obvious that many are offended here by Pope Francis choosing this approach. However, perhaps it is better to see such an approach in light of it being more of a sensitive acknowledgement of Lorenzo’s difficulties as someone who obviously “has issues” for it would be uncomely and unreflective of genuine Christ-centered love should Pope Francis react to him in a manner that is harsh and unkind, absconding from the conventions of human communicative decency. A good Biblical example to keep in mind here is the situation where Jesus was talking to the Woman at the Well. This woman was no “saint” in her moral life either for she was co-habiting with her partner instead of being married. This, however, did not stop Jesus from enaging in a long, no-doubt tender, unabashed conversation with her which in due time produced transformational results in her life on multiple levels both spiritual and temporal. So, when considering this approach then, we really have no place insofar as “pointing the finger” of negative judgement on Pope Francis for approaching the complex junctures of Lorenzo Carouso’s life-circumstances with the kind of sensitivity and objectivity he asserted into the midst of the situation since I think, like Jesus re: the Woman at the Well, he was way more concerned about the holistic nature of this man’s circumstances, and more particularly so in view of his prayer life and need for deep discernment in order to gain much more clarity about the nature of a God-given call, than he was about being negatively “nit-picky” over this & that. See, even Jesus would have not come down with a sledge-hammer on the Woman at the Well upon discoursing about her life, even those parts of it that needed changing in order to become more open and conformed to the work of sanctifying grace…He would rather, speak the truth to her in love – and that would be coupled too with a miraculous outworking of inner transformation for her and this because He is God. But it should be remembered and understood that, Pope Francis, although He is appointed as Vicar of Christ, is not God, and so cannot simply work miracles at will in the lives of those he meets. That said, I think his tact in the way he approached the tenuous complexity of this man’s situation reflects the desire to be as much as possible, likened unto Christ in the way he engages interpersonally with those he ministers to.
You make a good case in defense of the words and behavior of Francis. That “…Pope Francis [should] react to him in a manner that is harsh and unkind, absconding from the conventions of human communicative decency….” is to deflect and ignore Church teaching.
We choose: The teaching of Christ and His church OR Francis’ subscribing to ‘conventions of human communicative decency.’ The teaching of the Church and of Christ assures and is conducive to eternal happiness. Human constructs such as “conventions of human communicative decency” are conducive to disordered thinking, sin, and wasted lives when God and His Church are seen as ‘harsh and unkind.’ Simple truth: God is not harsh and unkind in pointing men to their eternal beatitude. Francis is derelict in not pointing this young man the way to his own well-being and that of the Church.
I often think of Pope Francis’ pastoral approach as Christ-like, and he deserves our respect. This story has not been confirmed, but like the ‘who am I to judge’ comment seems to imply an approach toward sinners which first appeals to their vulnerability and struggle, rather than immediate judgement.
Your comments, both, feature the sort of rationalizing, humanistic dialogue that New Age universalist unitarian pagans major on. Totally in contrast to the way of Jesus Christ & His Catholic Church, in which not one jot or triffle of God’s Law is to be set aside.
Recall, please: Jesus rebuked the woman-at-the-well by asking her to fetch her husband and then exposing her sinful sexual relationships. Her salvation came from her humble acceptance of God’s rebuke and honoring Him as The Messiah.
In both cases, Sueiyin & Angels, you are presenting a non-Catholic point of view; ignoring the fact that CWR is a website devoted to Catholic teaching and life.
It is a key part of God’s love for us that these rules are graciously given to protect us from evil and from an eternity in hell. Please do read the Catechism of the Catholic Church if you desire to know what rules have been set by nearly 2,000 years of Catholic divine inspiration, prayer, & godly thinking.
Jesus Christ [the one & only Authority over the heavens & the earth forever] also says: “Repent & believe The Good News!”; “Go and sin no more!”
His beloved Apostle John teaches that the reason Christ, The Eternal Word, became a human being was: “To destroy the works of the devil!” As with everything that Jesus said & did it was for our benefit & for our eternal happiness.
It is decidely not for the benefit of a man to toy with the devil by persisting in imagining he is sexually attracted to other men; it is definitely not for the benefit of a woman to toy with the devil by persisting in entertaining thoughts that she is sexually attracted to other women.
What IS for their everlasting benefit is: 1. saving faith in Christ and His teachings; 2. repentance from all that is not of Christ; 3. water baptism in the name of The Holy Trinity; 4. Holy Spirit baptism and a new life of metanoia and spiritual maturing in The Body of Jesus Christ, that is the Church; 5. regular prayer & receipt of the Sacraments; 6. a life of loving obedience to God’s commands; 7. humble perseverance in grateful dependence on the undeserved mercy of God.
Jesus Christ is THE way, THE truth, THE life, & THE light of this world.
No one will enter God’s glorious eternity but through Jesus Christ.
In John 10:27-30, we read that Jesus made plain THE way –
“My sheep listen to My Voice, I know them, they follow Me. I give them eternal life, they will never perish; no one can snatch them from My Hand.”
In many places in the Gospels, Jesus firmly instructs us that God’s promises apply to those who surrender themselves to obeying His commands and who are unashamed to lovingly tell the world of His very good news. It is not only SSA people who have to repent & reform; EVERY Christian knows they have to repent & carry their cross of self-denial, every day. It’s part of the deal! Heaven is worth the pain!
Do you believe this dear Sueiyin and dear Angela?
Men with unresolved SSA are not suitable candidates for priesthood or other ministries that require close work with vulnerable adults and children. In addition, until their SSA is properly resolved, they are in a state of mortal sin and can not become a communicating member of a Catholic parish, let alone a seminary.
Please don’t give credence to the discombobulating nonsense currently emerging from Rome. It is decidely not Catholic, not Christian, and not salvific.
Recall, please, Jesus warned us to beware imposters who come in His name.
Always under the grace & mercy of King Jesus Christ; love & blessings from marty
I am speechless.
Yet, dear ‘logboom’, senior Catholics have not been speechless but have been rebuking PF for years & years. E.G. –
April 30, 2019 (LifeSiteNews) – Prominent clergymen and scholars including Fr. Aidan Nichols, one of the best-known theologians in the English-speaking world, have issued an open letter accusing Pope Francis of committing heresy. They ask the bishops of the Catholic Church, to whom the open letter is addressed, to: “take the steps necessary to deal with the grave situation” of a pope committing this crime.
The authors base their charge of heresy on the manifold manifestations of Pope Francis’ embrace of positions contrary to the faith and his dubious support of prelates who in their lives have shown themselves to have a clear disrespect for the Church’s faith and morals.
“We take this measure as a last resort to respond to the accumulating harm caused by Pope Francis’s words and actions over several years, which have given rise to one of the worst crises in the history of the Catholic Church,” the authors state. The open letter is available in Dutch, Italian, German, French, and Spanish.
Among the signatories are well-respected scholars such as Father Thomas Crean, Fr. John Hunwicke, Professor John Rist, Dr. Anna Silvas, Professor Claudio Pierantoni, Dr. Peter Kwasniewski, and Dr. John Lamont. The text is dated “Easter Week” and appears on the traditional Feast Day of St. Catherine of Siena, a saint who counseled and admonished several popes in her time.
The 20-page document is a follow-up to the 2017 Filial Correction of Pope Francis that was signed originally by 62 scholars and which stated that the Pope has “effectively upheld 7 heretical positions about marriage, the moral life, and the reception of the sacraments, and has caused these heretical opinions to spread in the Catholic Church,” especially in light of his 2016 exhortation Amoris Laetitia.
The authors of the open letter state in a summary of their letter (read below) that it has now become clear that Pope Francis is aware of his own positions contrary to the faith and that the time has come to go a “stage further” by claiming that Pope Francis is “guilty of the crime of heresy.”
“We limit ourselves to accusing him of heresy on occasions where he has publicly denied truths of the faith, and then consistently acted in a way that demonstrates that he disbelieves these truths that he has publicly denied,” the authors state.
They clarify that they are not claiming Pope Francis has: “denied truths of the faith in pronouncements that satisfy the conditions for an infallible papal teaching.”
“We assert that this would be impossible, since it would be incompatible with the guidance given to the Church by the Holy Spirit,” they state.
In light of this situation, the authors call upon the bishops of the Church to take action since a: “heretical papacy may not be tolerated or dissimulated to avoid a worse evil.”
For this reason, the authors: “respectfully request the bishops of the Church to investigate the accusations contained in the letter, so that if they judge them to be well founded they may free the Church from her present distress, in accordance with the hallowed adage, Salus animarum prima lex (‘the salvation of souls is the highest law’). The bishops can do this, the writers suggest: “by admonishing Pope Francis to reject these heresies, and if he should persistently refuse, by declaring that he has freely deprived himself of the papacy.”
May 1, 2019 update: 12 more names of leading Catholics have been added to list of signers of the open letter, bringing total up to 31.
Very dangerous, evil and demonic decision! 😰 He proclaim not the gospel of Jesus Christ, instead he introduces another Christ, another Gospel, another spirit, another Church!! Read 2 Cori 11.4. That is what is happening through him..
Spot on with II Corinthians 11:4 –
A different Jesus who we have never heard of . . .
A different spirit who we have not received . . .
A different gospel that none of us accepted . . .
Out of the darkness comes this new-fangled, Bergoglian Anti-Apostolic Church, in short: the BAAL church; intended to overturn & evict our venerable Holy Catholic Apostlic Church.
It’s very dangerous… we have to pray hard. To recite the holy rosary many times.
Spot on with II Corinthians 11:4 –
A different Jesus who we have never heard of . . .
A different spirit who we have not received . . .
A different gospel that none of us accepted . . .
Undeceived by PF’s smoke-screen of: “Now you see me, now you don’t!” Catholics everywhere are waking up to the deviousness of this new-fangled, ‘Bergoglian Anti-Apostolic [BAAL] Church’, clearly intended to overturn & evict the godly tennets of our venerable Holy Catholic Apostolic Church.
Keep praying everybody.
Where in the gospel are non practicing homosexual oriented people barred from positions in the Church. Paul makes references to moral requirements but says nothing about one living as chaste homosexual. Ones orientation is not a sin and it doesn’t bar one from exemplary moral conduct or preclude one from being a saint. If this is so, why not a priest?
For the same reason we don’t allow pedophiles who aren’t acting out to be around children. It’s simply too risky and dangerous. Leaders should be above reproach.
When an “orientation” is acquired behavior as the result of habitualized sin, secular mythology of innocence notwithstanding, it says a lot about weaknesses of character that would warrant serious negative consideration.
Many people still completely miss the boat on this- it’s because SSA is a disorder of the person, regardless of whether they act on it or not. This is to say that it’s very difficult for such a person to be chaste, in what that technically means, which is not abstinence, which seems to be meaning in the question and is most often meant. Thus the issue is also not really whether they can be celibate or have “mastered their predisposition,” in the words of Mr. Beaulieu below. (How could one truly “master” disorder, which would arguably require healing from it, in which case they may no longer have SSA. Otherwise it may be largely physical abstention, which still always provides a struggle within the person.) If one also holds that SSA is more specifically a psychic disorder/mental illness- which all the evidence still points to- this is even more crucial. (There is still zero indication people are “born that way,” and this is now openly contradicted by transgender nonsense, which says there is no biological basis for our sexuality & that someone can change it through will power and thought.) Why would you even risk making someone a priest who may have a psychic disorder? Furthermore, it is well attested that those with SSA, even if one would argue they are born that way, most often suffer from various other psycho-emotional problems and disorders- depression, narcissism, tend to have high rates of substance abuse, suicide, etc. Again, why take a risk? One can also highlight some possible causes of SSA, with having been sexually abused/encroached upon while young as one of the most common. Such a person will have serious trauma, while this often leads them to commit such behavior themselves. This is one reason why homosexual men, including abusive clergy, comprise a very disproportionate amount of those who prey upon minors. Bishops especially who think ordaining those with SSA is not necessarily a problem, seem to have no clue that such factors need to be considered.
The lack of masculinity of men with SSA is also an issue, making them unsuitable to act in persona cristi. It also makes them of weak character, providing difficulty to speak and act forcibly about Church teaching or enact discipline. There is perhaps little doubt one reason behind the failure of some bishops and priests to defend Church teaching- especially about sexuality- or enact discipline, fail to reign in abusive priests, is because they have SSA. It may also actively lead them to propagate error, to rationalize their own SSA. One can think of the likes of Fr. James Martin or Bishop John Stowe here.
Is there any line in the questionnaire for admission that asks, “are you attracted to male or female”?
Unless one acts out on it or declares it publicly, how is a (chaste) homosexual (merely by orientation) determined and then barred from the seminary? Doesn’t make sense.
they ask
Candidates for seminary routinely participate in a ‘discernment’ that continues during seminary years. A spiritual director typically assists the candidate in assessing his suitability.
Church teaching is that homosexual orientation (even if in thought rather than act) is a DISORDERED INCLINATION. A man who would withhold his thoughts or inclinations in truthful open manifest discussion with his spiritual director hides the truth of his very self in the discernment process. He is presenting a false picture to the director, to the Church, and his very self. Such a man has no true ‘call’ from the Lord to the priesthood. As such, he is not a suitable candidate for the priesthood.
http://www.scborromeo.org/docs/on_priesthood_and_those_with_homosexual_tendencies.pdf
So when a young man comes to get a priest’s advice on his sexuality confusion, would not the priest be biased?
A question, a quote, and an observation…
First, if Caruso’s long letter to Pope Francis disclosed that he (himself) is entirely celibate and has mastered his predisposition, then none of this is really news. But such does not seem to be the case; the exchange almost sounds staged or at least predictably and cleverly timed. It’s hard to tell, again.
Second, a recent reminiscence on the longer trend, from Benedict XVI:
“Until the Second Vatican Council, Catholic moral theology was broadly founded on natural law, with Sacred Scripture cited only for background or substantiation. In the council’s struggle for a new understanding of revelation, the natural law option was almost completely set aside, and a moral theology based entirely on the Bible was demanded” (“The Church and the Scandal of Sexual Abuse,” in “What is Christianity [?]: The Last Writings,” Ignatius, 2023, p. 180).
Third, Benedict adds elsewhere about the Bible, that in the Lutheran bible the word for the universal and Eucharistic “Church” is almost completely replaced by the local “community”—as reduced from the sacramental to simply an office for bottoms-up reading clubs. So, what does it mean, now, when such ecclesial “communities” share the same terminology as the politicized new religion of the LGBTQ “community?” And with the language of gesture, signaling and private notes being passed in school?
In small half-steps, rather than the Church being welcoming, is the Church being annexed?
The pope’s informal, spontaneous, and handwritten note lends itself to a “plausible deniability” of sorts—a very familiar technique imported from corporate boardrooms (the old secular equivalent to the new clericalism!)—the same as informal and spontaneous semi-blessings of “couples” under Fiducia Supplicans.
Just some surely random stuff, here; and who am I to judge?
So what is the cart and what the horse- natural law philosophy or the Bible?
God is the source of both natural law (because He is the author of all of creation) and the Bible. Therefore they will not contradict… if we understand them both correctly.
The first as confirmed and elevated by the latter. Almost as if were are made to be receptive to the truth in Person.
It doesn’t matter. The scriptures clearly teach that actively gay people cannot and will not inherit the kingdom. It’s quite clear.
The key word being “actively” gay. Is this any different than being actively sexual outside of one’s marriage?
There are differences. The homosexual disorder whether innate in the person or cultivated, is not to be preferred in the person but must actively be displaced. Whereas the natural sexual constitution is meant to be preserved in stable disposition.
Second “differentiation” is to do with dimension. Stop trying to justify anything homosexual whether as it stands on its own or by “comparisons” and “contrasts” with other conditions or disorders.
Yes, it’s different but there are similarities. Every sin resembles another in a certain way.
Not sure how your meaning might be misinterpreted by some…
So, yes and no. “Yes,” there is no difference, in that heterosexual immorality, like much else, also violates human nature and moral absolutes (as explained in the Catechism and more explicitly in Veritatis Splendor). But, “no,” if the misinterpretation–by some readers–might be that binary sexual intercourse (“outside of one’s marriage”) and homosexual mechanics (even redefining “marriage”) are indifferently equivalent….
Instead, there’s this address from Cardinal Erdo as the relator to the 1995 session on the Synod on the Family:
“‘There are absolutely no grounds for considering homosexual unions to be in any way similar or even remotely analogous to God’s plan for marriage and family.’….” (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Considerations Regarding Proposals to Give Legal Recognition to Unions Between Homosexual Persons, 4, Instrumentum Laboris 130). See Section III.3: https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/32772/full-text-of-cardinal-erdos-introductory-report-for-the-synod-on-the-family
An address well worth reading again. And, perhaps, in the decade or two ahead, we might even see an inspired uptick in single-hearted vocations to the celibate priesthood and restoration of equally single-hearted vocations to faithful marriage and families, both.
And now the appointment of three blind trapeze artists to the swinging Dicastery for the Doctrine of the Faith.
https://onepeterfive.com/francis-appoints-homosexualists-to-shape-doctrine/
Out with nuptial, sacramental imagery and traditional Church wisdom.
In with inner conflict, imprecise speech (“all” as in women, e.g.?), misplaced ecclesial “clericalism” and the “tenderness” that “leads to the gas chamber” (Flannery O’Connor).
How great is this? That whole repentance thing is so backwardist!
No more sin any more! We are free from our suicidal boxes!
So eat, drink and be merry! (Or Mary, if that’s the way you play.)
Jesus calls all! All!
You, your neighbor’s wife, your German Shepherd Giselle, and even your Electrolux washer when it’s on the spin cycle!
Oh yeah! It’s open season on anything that moves! Bergoglio says so!
And Bergoglio knows his O’s!
Let’s face it. Bergoglio’s right. Christianity just isn’t that much fun.
Daft!
Obviously the Pontiff still hasn’t gotten around to reading
Religiosorum Institutio Instruction on the Careful Selection And Training Of Candidates For The States Of Perfection And Sacred Orders
from February of 1961 which reads in part:
30. Those To Be Excluded; Practical Directives:
Advantage to religious vows and ordination should be barred to those who are afflicted with evil tendencies to homosexuality or pederasty, since for them the common life and the priestly ministry would constitute serious dangers.
It is in that same stack of reading material with the dubia. I’m sure he will get to in soon.
I actually proposed betting odds with several very orthodox Catholic friends of mine regarding how long the other side of his Peronism would take to show up after his crude but appropriate comment on the condition of Italian seminaries. I won. They thought it would take a couple of months. I said less than one month. They owe me a beer.
Ridiculous.
Wake me up when it’s over.
Confusion is the consistent product of the words of pope Francis. He beats the drum of anti-clericalism to placate the desire for a host of other sins. There is the pose of humility and holiness, but it is tarnished by the support for those behaviors God has condemned from the beginning.
I pray for him.
Any time soon to call an Imperfect Council?!
Bishops, Cardinals?
Any?!
Once again we confront Jorge Mario Bergoglio performing what has become a wearisome spectacle that some have called his “Peronist” maneuver; namely, saying one thing which is Catholic and actually doing its opposite which is not only non-Catholic but also morally evil. What surprises me after all this time is that those in the Church observing this resolutely wish it away and refuse to answer the unavoidable questions: “Is Bergoglio a homosexual?”, “Is Bergoglio a heretic?”, and “Is Bergoglio an apostate?”
He has reportedly used gutter language for gays frequently, and always has been keen for gossip on moral failings of other churchmen, where he then surrounds himself with these failures, them afraid of exposure, while he protects them as long as possible, which pattern has repeated numerous times in this pontificate….he uses others for power…his latest word games only more of same, from which he has drawn support from both sides…while always plausible deniability either direction, only his official acts pointing the way of his true agenda, which ain’t good.
IS he Pope? If not WHO?
Dear Paul – a heartfelt question, so many good Catholics want answered.
Yet, those in authority [cardinals, archbishops, bishops, etc.] have long known that PF is of the anti-Apostolic, anything goes, worldly libertine faction in our Church.
Sadly, most of them are mesmerized and reduced to a zombi-like state of aquiescence. This is because by years of managerial prioritizing they have separated themselves from the faithful flock of Catholics who are following our LORD Jesus Christ.
Lets keep praying for Pope Francis and all the leaders to have a life-changing ‘Damascus Road’ encounter with King Jesus Christ.
Always in the love of The Lamb of GOD; blessings from marty
I don’t believe this is correct: …said: “Jesus calls all, all.”
at least not for a vocation
I wonder how the clergy who as Bishop of Burnie Airies in Argentina witnessed the Eucharist Miracle cd dare to contempt the teaching of the Bible. Very soon we shall hear another un-Godly preaching like saying “A poor person can steal from the rich to have his expenses fulfilled!” We should pray to the Catholic church as it has become a laughingstock from the Moslems and other Abrahamic religions.
Cold and hot. Just to let people more confused. The Word of God is the Truth, the Path and the Life.
Is it just me, or is that a decidedly evil grin Bergoglio is sporting in the St. Peter’s Square photo, above?
It’s not just you, brineyman, it is anyone who would project their own fears and shame onto a person smiling. The abyss may be looking back at you.
Dear ‘brineyman’ & dear ‘DanM’ – on this occasion it seems you both miss the target.
God in Christ Jesus instructs us to avoid judging by a person’s appearance and to focus on the fruits of their life.
As amply demonstrated in this & many other articles over the last 6 years and in the current string of learned comments, our current pope looks good, speaks good, and has produced an unprecedented crop of toxic fruit.
No one who cares about the salavtion of souls should be embarassed to openly rebuke him for his bad fruit. It is responsible love not pride to render that service.
Being one in The Body of Christ & one in the Holy Spirit of GOD, it is our meritorious duty to humbly proclaim the truth, without fear or favor.
Catholics who remain silent in the face of anti-Apostolic teachings & actions are sinning because they are passive accomplices of wrong.
Always seeking to hear & lovingly follow King Jesus Christ; blessings from marty
The problem is language or misuse of it.
A man isn’t called a philanderer if he has an inclination to look at another woman not his wife, but fights it and resists.
The same should be for Lorenzo he shouldn’t be barred from the priesthood in the same way if he can bridle his instincts and look to God.
The Pope is right, the priesthood should be open to all dispositions of sin, the challenge surely then for all is to double down on the narrow path.
Where it’s unclear is if Lorenzo has professed his rejection of sin, vs. the culture’s language (which is completely wrong and the church and all should stand against) that “I was born this way”. Again, a man might be born in such a way as to have feelings towards another woman not his wife, but the church and Christ set a higher standard for all.
Homosexual inclinations are not an instinct. They are intrinsically disordered desires that result from deep and unhealed wounds, quite distinct from the wound of original sin that we all share. Those wounds have wide-ranging effects well beyond disordered sexual desires, which make it a bad idea to put such people into the more difficult life of a priest (more difficult in part because demons target priests more than laity) and also to expect them to be capable of behaving like a father to so many different people.
The idea that they were “born this way” is nonsense. What is not nonsense is that their brains are distinctly, physically different. Unhealed childhood trauma or neglect will do that.
Thanks for these illuminating facts, dear Amanda.
In consequence it would be highly irresponsible to encourage such people to become seminarians.
This might have legs if the church weren’t full of f…gt priests, no?
I’m sharing the thoughts of a theologian I highly respect, which I believe summarize what we should consider about the papal office (even though expressed five years ago, I still consider these considerations valid)
“The Pope is surrounded by impostors – those whom Cardinal Mueller calls the ‘magic circle’ – and who are more traditionally called ‘courtiers,’ partly because he seeks them out and partly because they attempt the mad endeavor of establishing modernism in the Holy See, in accordance with the wishes of the famous modernist Ernesto Buonaiuti at the beginning of the last century.
However, despite the machinations of the modernists, the Pope, when moved by the Spirit to infallibly teach some Catholic truth, cannot resist the sweet and strong impulse of the Spirit, which keeps him from error, because the Spirit itself infallibly moves the Pope’s will to desire to speak the truth. No Pope ever intends to deceive the faithful in matters of faith. It is blasphemy to even think so.
Therefore, no Pope, thanks to the gift of the Petrine ministry, can ever wish to renounce, at the appropriate time, his infallibility, not out of negligence or false humility, but precisely in obedience to his duty to confirm the brethren in the truth of faith. The Holy Spirit prevents him from sinning in faith without forcing him, but for the good of the Church. A Pope can have all the vices, but not that of unbelief, heresy, or apostasy. Pope Francis is not without sins, but in matters of faith, he cannot be wrong. Let us trust him and try to understand him even when he is unclear or ambiguous. Let us criticize him on everything, but not on matters of faith. Above all, let us help him in guiding the Church and pray for him.”
That “theologian” is absurdly wrong. A pope can even be an atheist, although, like most atheists, not likely with a conscious awareness that his beliefs are atheistic.
In truth, among the traditionalists, there are some honest but confused or scandalized souls who listen to this theologian when he shows them that the Pope does not contradict Tradition at all, but rather may be lacking in pastoral care or moral conduct. Meanwhile, there are other rancorous, stubborn, and presumptuous spirits who, seeing that this theologian criticizes the Pope, want to drag him into their extremism or want him to consent to their insults against the Pope. To this, he responds with reproaches, even to the point of breaking off the conversation if necessary, while I only know how to pray (and obviously not even very well!).
As usual, you are defending the indefensible and committing a grave sin in the process. You should not be professing faith and simultaneously defending the pope’s error here. A gay man should be firmly discouraged from seeking the priesthood and any application to seminary should be rejected on that basis.
Paolo,
One key distinction is between the pope’s adherence to doctrine versus his errors or worse in governance, which only enable or surely aid and abet the prevailing agenda of the LGBTQ religion.
Another key distinction in “papal infallibility” is that this term refers broadly to the Church indwelled by the Holy Spirit and, therefore, to papal definitions–and not to the pope as a person. The pope is not a prophet in receipt of a blank check for his private use. A fine line, here, subject to convenient day-to-day ambiguity. Here’s the definition as precisely stated at the First Vatican Council:
“The Roman Pontiff when he speaks ex cathedra, that is, when exercising the office of pastor and teacher of all Christians, he defines [!] with his supreme authority a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, through the divine assistance promised to him in St. Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the divine Redeemer willed his Church [!] to be endowed in defining doctrine concerning faith and morals: and therefore such definitions [!] of the Roman Pontiff are irreformable of themselves (and not from the consent of the Church).”
So, the exact meaning of “papal infallibility” where there’s nothing about photo-ops, or non-verbal signaling, or appointments, disappointments and exiles, or name calling, or a long pattern of seemingly off-the-wall memes floated on airplanes, or attributed and uncorrected and broadcast by atheist journalists, secularist nomads, and media talking heads, or about Vatican Garden parties for Pachamama idols. . . .or about popolatry.
A somewhat artless track record!
The constructive criticism is not about “faith;” instead maybe this: “Art is like morals [and governance?], a line has to be drawn somewhere” (G.K. Chesterton).
Exactly, right! Thank you.
A large number of comments reveal an acceptance of homosexuality usually conditioned by willingness to live a chaste life, others make no mention. Although the Pope’s response for an admitted homosexual to continue toward the priesthood is a message with far reaching implications. It affirms that to be, to consider, to choose to be homosexual is acceptable for the Church whether priest or layman. Not that it is simply tolerable, but that it is now universally accepted as a moral good.
That informal position by Pope Francis gives license to everyone to follow disordered thoughts regarding their sexual behavior at least insofar as preference. It informally [as distinct from a formal ex cathedra pronouncement] declares what the Church formally declares a moral disorder is not a moral disorder. It affirms the positions of Cardinals McElroy, Hollerich, and Fr James Martin. Although informal it’s the most sweeping repudiation of perennial Church doctrine on moral behavior in the history of Catholicism.
Fr. they also impute and sometimes make it explicit that those who stand against their disordered inclinations/appetites, etc., are the disordered category. That that standing against is a disorder. It adds to their error yet they try to make it seem a virtue.
Thank you. Excellent point Elias. Some argue only an inclination. An inclination is a natural appetite or desire directed by the will. Sin is the willful privation of direction to a due end. We can redirect our natural desires to a sinful end.
To give further account to “We can redirect our natural desires to a sinful end”, the Catechism states that the same sex inclination is not, of itself sinful. Although that may be true in some instances. Not all [based on God’s formation of the human person male and female with natural desires consistent with their sex]. We can willfully direct our desires toward a disordered end as in what’s vaguely described same sex attraction. As if that sensual desire is natural. That is putatively true in rare cases, when there is an ‘accident’ in nature, some physical impediment. Otherwise the same sex inclination is elective, an acquired behavior. There often are socio psychological dynamics that influence the attraction, which to degrees may mitigate culpability for the attraction. However, the same sex act in each and every instance as the Catechism teaches is sinful.
Fr. just found your note. Your points speak to James Connor and David among others. We know that the baptized can suffer the lingering effects of Original Sin. This is getting lost everywhere as simultaneous argumentation from all sides baptized and not baptized swamps the issues; where even the baptized add confusion. I don’t mean to be “over-critical” on them.
Don’t mean to lecture to Fr. only try to express what appears to be involved. Briefly with 2 points. 1. All kinds of motions can be mixed into or mixed up with Original Sin and its consequent impact before the will acts and after the will has acted. 2. The monopolizing of the topic by unbelievers, secularity, disbelief and false justice, is the work of Satan.
Arn’t we all born with moral disorders having original sin? We all have to deal with it differently.
No James Connor, we have to respond to the grace of God.
But incidentally, your adverbial “differently” confounds your question on Original Sin. You landed your frisbee into electrical wires there expecting me to run into them and get it for you; high tension, but I didn’t.
No James, original sin does not imply predestination for sin. And the intrinsic willful moral corruption of homosexuality is made clear by how the behavior correlates with affectations of a refusal to fully grow up, an obsessive pursuit of comfort, the retaining of children’s toys and attire, etc. And an evil mindset creates a near unanimous support for abortion among gays despite not deriving any personal convenience.
No. Don’t defend the indefensible. The call is the same to all – repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near. Jesus’s own words.
We are all born with original sin & because of that are more vulnerable to moral disorders.
The point is that homosexuals do not accept it or speak of it as a “moral disorder.” Quite the contrary, they embrace it as a “gift,” a God-given “identity.” Just imagine a serial adulterer talking about his moral failings as an “identity.” Complete nonsense.
“Moral disorders”? Or, rather only an “inclination” to possibly choose and act upon such disorders.
So, none of us is totally depraved (the false premise of Martin Luther), but our created-good human nature is now marred by an inclination. A critical distinction, this, leaving room for free will…
And, a distinction that still required clarification (in defense of human nature) even after the Lutheran/Catholic Joint Declaration of Justification (1999). Readers can notice that the brief Preface reads in part, “The solemn confirmation of this Joint Declaration on 31 October 1999 in Augsburg, by means of the Official Common Statement with its ANNEX [!], represents an ecumenical event of historical significance.”
The integral ANNEX provides the cleverly-blurred and yet irreducible distinction between salvation by grace alone (elsewhere verbalized, in words attributed to Luther, that we remain as “dung covered with snow”), versus the Catholic doctrine that fallen man is not totally depraved, but rather suffers only from concupiscence—the tendency toward sin—and is free. The five-page Annex reads in part:
“The concept of ‘concupiscence’ is used in different senses on the Catholic and Lutheran sides. In the Lutheran Confessional writings ‘concupiscence’ is understood as the self-seeking desire of the human being, which in light of the law, spiritually understood, is regarded as sin [!]. In the Catholic understanding concupiscence is an inclination [!], remaining in human beings even after baptism, which comes from sin and presses toward sin [….]”
The Preface explains that the Declaration is to be read in conjunction with this clarification, and not without it (omitted in Lutheran versions and by aligned gender-theory ideology). This distinction in defense of the human person refutes the sloppy thinking of der Synodal Weg, holding instead that the homosexual inclination by itself (like all such inclinations) is not a sin, but that it is an objective evil to be resisted with the aid of grace from beyond ourselves—as are all other temptations of whatever stripe.
Summary: don’t eat yellow snow.
Then they wonder why we have good people leaving the Catholic Faith… Homosexuals are on the move and want every possible way they can to get into the church and all areas of society–look at all the Gay Pride parades and Drag Queen events. No knowing homosexual should be allowed to become clergy. Period!
You are right, dear Darlene. It is like a tidal wave.
Many in the Church will be swept away as flotsam & jetsum.
Some strong trees will be left standing, giving glory to God, once its all past.
Read Leviticus 18:22 & 20:13. If this man has renounced his homosexuality, then he should become a seminarian. Apparently, he has not.
Same as above post, Francis fancies himself an unpredictable Machiavellian/Peronist who knows the way to maintain power is to be unpredictable to friends and foes alike. Folk trying to shoehorn him into rational or even Catholic patterns will always be disappointed. He has reversed decisions dear to him, purely because the decisions leaked and spoiled his suprise. The only thing predictable was his about-face.
Gays don’t belong in the priesthood. The church sex abuse issue was overwhelmingly male priest to male seminarian or male child. These actions have served to bankrupt several dioceses and seriously impacted the ability of the church to function. Encouraging men with a serious emotional problem such as homosexuality to enter the priesthood seems like an obviously poor decision. It is clear by now that this pope has a conflicted idea of this issue. Lets hope the next Pope has appropriate priorities where homosexuality is concerned.
The mere fact that this young man prattles on and on about “sexual orientation” (which does not exist), instead of recognizing temptation to sin and the need to resist it, demonstrates clearly that he has no vocation. He would be a disaster in many functions a priest must exercise.
I suggest to Lorenzo Michele Noè Caruso, knock any jesuit organization door. They will welcome him with open arms. He is recommended by the higest jusuit at this right moment.
The logic of our current pontiff that allows for a homosexual to enter a seminary would seem also to allow for a straight male to join a monastery of straight females, or for a straight female to join a monastery of straight males. I suspect that our pontiff doesn’t seem to think that sexual lust or behavior–whether it be sodomy, fornication, or masturbation—would interfere with the formation in the Spirit, let alone thinking they are serious sins. It is better to believe his predecessor, St Peter, in his second letter (2Peter 2) who strongly warns against lust and the sins of the flesh.
I really think Pope Francis is right when he decries clericalism within the Church because what he actually means when he criticizes it as “worldly” is that it’s the “cliquish” nature of clericalism that is worldly as it’s built on an exclusivistic snobbery which is at loggerheads with the central message of the Gospel anyhow. I’m simply calling Pope Francis right for condemning clericalism or “the snobbery of officialdom”.
As regards him encouraging Lorenzo Carouso in discerning his vocation, Pope Francis’ position is more along the lines of guiding this man to continue to pray into the issue of his discipleship irrespective of the fact Lorenzo is struggling with sexual orientation issues. And it is obvious that many are offended here by Pope Francis choosing this approach. However, perhaps it is better to see such an approach in light of it being more of a sensitive acknowledgement of Lorenzo’s difficulties as someone who obviously “has issues” for it would be uncomely and unreflective of genuine Christ-centered love should Pope Francis react to him in a manner that is harsh and unkind, absconding from the conventions of human communicative decency. A good Biblical example to keep in mind here is the situation where Jesus was talking to the Woman at the Well. This woman was no “saint” in her moral life either for she was co-habiting with her partner instead of being married. This, however, did not stop Jesus from enaging in a long, no-doubt tender, unabashed conversation with her which in due time produced transformational results in her life on multiple levels both spiritual and temporal. So, when considering this approach then, we really have no place insofar as “pointing the finger” of negative judgement on Pope Francis for approaching the complex junctures of Lorenzo Carouso’s life-circumstances with the kind of sensitivity and objectivity he asserted into the midst of the situation since I think, like Jesus re: the Woman at the Well, he was way more concerned about the holistic nature of this man’s circumstances, and more particularly so in view of his prayer life and need for deep discernment in order to gain much more clarity about the nature of a God-given call, than he was about being negatively “nit-picky” over this & that. See, even Jesus would have not come down with a sledge-hammer on the Woman at the Well upon discoursing about her life, even those parts of it that needed changing in order to become more open and conformed to the work of sanctifying grace…He would rather, speak the truth to her in love – and that would be coupled too with a miraculous outworking of inner transformation for her and this because He is God. But it should be remembered and understood that, Pope Francis, although He is appointed as Vicar of Christ, is not God, and so cannot simply work miracles at will in the lives of those he meets. That said, I think his tact in the way he approached the tenuous complexity of this man’s situation reflects the desire to be as much as possible, likened unto Christ in the way he engages interpersonally with those he ministers to.
You make a good case in defense of the words and behavior of Francis. That “…Pope Francis [should] react to him in a manner that is harsh and unkind, absconding from the conventions of human communicative decency….” is to deflect and ignore Church teaching.
We choose: The teaching of Christ and His church OR Francis’ subscribing to ‘conventions of human communicative decency.’ The teaching of the Church and of Christ assures and is conducive to eternal happiness. Human constructs such as “conventions of human communicative decency” are conducive to disordered thinking, sin, and wasted lives when God and His Church are seen as ‘harsh and unkind.’ Simple truth: God is not harsh and unkind in pointing men to their eternal beatitude. Francis is derelict in not pointing this young man the way to his own well-being and that of the Church.
I often think of Pope Francis’ pastoral approach as Christ-like, and he deserves our respect. This story has not been confirmed, but like the ‘who am I to judge’ comment seems to imply an approach toward sinners which first appeals to their vulnerability and struggle, rather than immediate judgement.
Dear Sueiyin Ho & dear Angela Malek.
Your comments, both, feature the sort of rationalizing, humanistic dialogue that New Age universalist unitarian pagans major on. Totally in contrast to the way of Jesus Christ & His Catholic Church, in which not one jot or triffle of God’s Law is to be set aside.
Recall, please: Jesus rebuked the woman-at-the-well by asking her to fetch her husband and then exposing her sinful sexual relationships. Her salvation came from her humble acceptance of God’s rebuke and honoring Him as The Messiah.
In both cases, Sueiyin & Angels, you are presenting a non-Catholic point of view; ignoring the fact that CWR is a website devoted to Catholic teaching and life.
It is a key part of God’s love for us that these rules are graciously given to protect us from evil and from an eternity in hell. Please do read the Catechism of the Catholic Church if you desire to know what rules have been set by nearly 2,000 years of Catholic divine inspiration, prayer, & godly thinking.
Jesus Christ [the one & only Authority over the heavens & the earth forever] also says: “Repent & believe The Good News!”; “Go and sin no more!”
His beloved Apostle John teaches that the reason Christ, The Eternal Word, became a human being was: “To destroy the works of the devil!” As with everything that Jesus said & did it was for our benefit & for our eternal happiness.
It is decidely not for the benefit of a man to toy with the devil by persisting in imagining he is sexually attracted to other men; it is definitely not for the benefit of a woman to toy with the devil by persisting in entertaining thoughts that she is sexually attracted to other women.
What IS for their everlasting benefit is: 1. saving faith in Christ and His teachings; 2. repentance from all that is not of Christ; 3. water baptism in the name of The Holy Trinity; 4. Holy Spirit baptism and a new life of metanoia and spiritual maturing in The Body of Jesus Christ, that is the Church; 5. regular prayer & receipt of the Sacraments; 6. a life of loving obedience to God’s commands; 7. humble perseverance in grateful dependence on the undeserved mercy of God.
Jesus Christ is THE way, THE truth, THE life, & THE light of this world.
No one will enter God’s glorious eternity but through Jesus Christ.
In John 10:27-30, we read that Jesus made plain THE way –
“My sheep listen to My Voice, I know them, they follow Me. I give them eternal life, they will never perish; no one can snatch them from My Hand.”
In many places in the Gospels, Jesus firmly instructs us that God’s promises apply to those who surrender themselves to obeying His commands and who are unashamed to lovingly tell the world of His very good news. It is not only SSA people who have to repent & reform; EVERY Christian knows they have to repent & carry their cross of self-denial, every day. It’s part of the deal! Heaven is worth the pain!
Do you believe this dear Sueiyin and dear Angela?
Men with unresolved SSA are not suitable candidates for priesthood or other ministries that require close work with vulnerable adults and children. In addition, until their SSA is properly resolved, they are in a state of mortal sin and can not become a communicating member of a Catholic parish, let alone a seminary.
Please don’t give credence to the discombobulating nonsense currently emerging from Rome. It is decidely not Catholic, not Christian, and not salvific.
Recall, please, Jesus warned us to beware imposters who come in His name.
Always under the grace & mercy of King Jesus Christ; love & blessings from marty
If this is true….. For sure the African Catholic Church will break away…. 100% sure