Republican vice presidential candidate Sen. J.D. Vance, R-Ohio, speaks during a fundraising event at Discovery World on July 17, 2024, in Milwaukee. (Credit: Anna Moneymaker/Getty Images)
At 39 years old, Ohio Sen. James David “J.D.” Vance, Donald Trump’s newly announced running mate in the 2024 election, has a chance to become the United States’ second Catholic vice president.
Vance is the second-youngest member of the U.S. Senate. He took office in 2023.
He was baptized and confirmed in the Catholic Church at the age of 35 at St. Gertrude’s, a Dominican priory in Cincinnati.
In a 2020 article in The Lamp titled “On Mamaw and Becoming Catholic,” Vance reflected on his conversion as a process that occurred “slowly and unevenly” over several years.
According to Vance, his gradual journey to the faith was inspired by the example of his grandmother, “Mamaw,” whom he describes as “a woman of deep, but completely de-institutionalized, faith.”
After growing up in a poor Appalachian home, serving four years in the Marines, and earning a law degree from Yale, Vance says he considered himself an atheist.
Despite defying the odds of his humble upbringing and rising through the economic and social ranks, Vance said he was not happy with his state in life, and he began developing an inclination toward Christianity and Catholicism in particular.
“I began to wonder: Were all these worldly markers of success actually making me a better person? I had traded virtue for achievement and found the latter wanting,” he wrote. “There was a voice in my head that demanded better of me.”
“I felt desperate for a worldview that understood our bad behavior as simultaneously social and individual, structural and moral; that recognized that we are products of our environment; that we have a responsibility to change that environment, but that we are still moral beings with individual duties; one that could speak against rising rates of divorce and addiction, not as sanitized conclusions about their negative social externalities, but with moral outrage.”
More than any political philosophy, Vance wrote that he soon realized that this worldview he had been looking for was one he had long known: “It was my Mamaw’s Christianity.”
“Despite my Mamaw’s unfamiliarity with the liturgy, the Roman and Italian cultural influences, and the foreign pope, I slowly began to see Catholicism as the closest expression of her kind of Christianity, a faith centered around a Christ who demands perfection of us even as he loves unconditionally and forgives easily,” he wrote.
It was “the Catholic part of my heart” that Vance said demanded he think about the things that truly matter, that he treat his son with patience, moderate his temper, value his family above his income and prestige, and forgive those who have wronged him.
“If I wanted that part of me to be nurtured and to grow, I needed to do more than read the occasional book of theology or reflect on my own shortcomings. I needed to pray more, to participate in the sacramental life of the Church, to confess and to repent publicly, no matter how awkward that might be,” he said.
“And I needed grace. I needed, in other words, to become Catholic, not merely to think about it.”
In a November 2022 interview with “EWTN News Nightly,” Vance described the history and richness of the Catholic faith as the forces that guide his politics, saying that “one of the great takeaways of the Catholic tradition is that you both have a public policy that protects life and also respects the dignity of the American worker.”
If you value the news and views Catholic World Report provides, please consider donating to support our efforts. Your contribution will help us continue to make CWR available to all readers worldwide for free, without a subscription. Thank you for your generosity!
Click here for more information on donating to CWR. Click here to sign up for our newsletter.
Maureen McKinley milks one of her family’s goats in their backyard with help from three of her children, Madeline (behind), Fiona and Augustine on Monday, Aug. 2, 2021. McKinley and her family own two goats, chickens, a rabbit, and a dog. / Jake Kelly
Denver Newsroom, Aug 10, 2021 / 16:32 pm (CNA).
With five children ages 10 and under to care for, and a pair of goats, a rabbit, chickens and a dog to tend to, Maureen and Matt McKinley rely on a structured routine to keep their busy lives on track.
Chores, nap times, scheduled story hours – they’re all important staples of their day. But the center of the McKinleys’ routine, what focuses their family life and strengthens their Catholic faith, they say, is the Traditional Latin Mass.
Its beauty, reverence, and timelessness connect them to a rich liturgical legacy that dates back centuries.
“This is the Mass that made so many saints throughout time,” observes Maureen, 36, a parishioner at Mater Misericordiæ Catholic Church in Phoenix.
“You know what Mass St. Alphonsus Ligouri, St. Therese, St. Teresa of Avila and St. Augustine were attending? The Traditional Latin Mass,” Maureen says.
“We could have a conversation about it, and we would have all experienced the exact same thing,” she says. “That’s exciting.”
Recent developments in the Catholic Church, however, have curbed some of that excitement. On July 16, Pope Francis released a motu proprio titled Traditiones custodis, or “Guardians of the Tradition”, that has cast doubt on the future of the Traditional Latin Mass (TLM) – and deeply upset and confused many of its devotees.
Pope Francis’ directive rescinds the freedom Pope Benedict XVI granted to priests 14 years ago to say Masses using the Roman Missal of 1962, the form of liturgy prior to Vatican II, without first seeking their bishop’s approval. Under the new rules, bishops now have the “exclusive competence” to decide where, when, and whether the TLM can be said in their dioceses.
In a letter accompanying the motu proprio, Pope Francis maintains that the faculties granted to priests by his predecessor have been “exploited to widen the gaps, reinforce the divergences, and encourage disagreements that injure the Church, block her path, and expose her to the peril of division.”
Using the word “unity” a total of 15 times in the accompanying letter, the pope suggests that attending the TLM is anything but unifying, going so far as to correlate a strong personal preference for such masses with a rejection of Vatican II.
Weeks later, many admirers of the “extraordinary” form of the Roman rite – the McKinleys among them – are still struggling to wrap their minds and hearts around the pope’s order, and the pointed tone he used to deliver it.
Maureen McKinley says she had never considered herself a “traditionalist Catholic” before. Instead, she says she and her husband have just “always moved toward the most reverent way to worship and the best way to teach our children.”
“It didn’t feel like I became a particular type of Catholic by going to Mater Misericordiæ. But since the motu proprio came out, I feel like I have been categorized, like I was something different, something other than the rest of the Church,” she says.
“It feels like our Holy Father doesn’t understand this whole group of people who love our Lord so much.”
McKinley isn’t alone in feeling this way. Sadness, anger, frustration, and disbelief are some common themes in conversations among those who regularly attend the TLM.
They want to understand and support the Holy Father, but they also see the restriction as unnecessary, especially when plenty of other more pressing issues in the Church abound.
Eric Matthews, another Mater Misericordiæ parishioner, views the new restrictions as an “attack on devout Catholic culture,” citing the beauty that exists across the rites recognized within the Church. There are seven rites recognized in the Catholic Church: Latin, Byzantine, Alexandrian or Coptic, Syriac, Armenian, Maronite, and Chaldean.
“It’s the same Mass,” says Matthews, 39, who first discovered the TLM about eight years ago. “It’s just different languages, different cultures, but the people that you have there are there for the right reasons.”
Eric and Geneva Matthews with their four children. / Narissa Lowicki
Different paths to the TLM
The pope’s motu proprio directly affects a tiny fraction of U.S. Catholics – perhaps as few as 150,000, or less than 1 percent of some 21 million regular Mass-goers, according to some estimates. According to one crowd-sourced database, only about 700 venues – compared to over 16,700 parishes nationwide – offer the TLM.
Also, since the motu proprio’s release July 16, only a handful of bishops have stopped the TLM in their dioceses. Of those bishops who have made public responses, most are allowing the Masses to continue as before – in some cases because they see no evidence of disunity, and in others because they need more time to study the issue.
But for those who feel drawn to the TLM – for differing reasons that have nothing to do with a rejection of Vatican II – it feels as if the ground has shifted under their feet.
Maureen McKinley wants her children to understand the importance of hard work, of which they have no shortage when it comes to their urban farm. After morning prayer, Maureen milks the family’s goats with the help of the children. Madeline (age 10) feeds the bunny; Augustine (7) exercises the dog; John (6) checks for eggs from the chickens; and Michael (4) helps anyone he chooses.
With a noisy clatter in the kitchen, the McKinleys eat breakfast, tidy up their rooms, and begin their daily activities. They break at 11 a.m. to head to daily Mass at Mater Misericordiæ, an apostolate of the Priestly Fraternity of Saint Peter (FSSP), where they first attended two years ago.
Matt, 34, wanted to know how the early Christians worshipped.
“The funny thing about converts is they’re always wanting more,” says Maureen, who was, at first, a little resistant to the idea of attending the TLM because she didn’t know Latin. “Worship was a big part of his conversion.”
Maureen agreed to follow her husband’s lead, and they continued to attend the TLM. What kept them coming back week after week was the reverence for the Eucharist.
“Matt had a really hard time watching so many people receive communion in the hand at the other parish,” says Maureen. “He says he didn’t want our kids to think that that was the standard. That’s the exception to the rule, not the rule.”
Reverence in worship also drew Elizabeth Sisk to the TLM. A 28-year-old post-anesthesia care unit nurse, she attends both the Novus Ordo, the Mass promulgated by St. Paul VI in 1969, and the extraordinary form in Raleigh, North Carolina, where her parish, the Holy Name of Jesus Cathedral, offers the TLM on the first Sunday of the month.
Sisk has noticed recently that more people in her area — especially young people who are converts to Catholicism — are attending both forms of the Mass. While the Novus Ordo is what brought many of them, herself included, to the faith, she feels that the extraordinary form invites them to go deeper.
“We want to do something radical with our lives,” Sisk says. “To be Catholic right now as a young person is a really radical decision. I think the people who choose to be Catholic right now, we’re all in. We don’t want ‘watered-down’ Catholicism.”
Elizabeth Sisk stands in front of Holy Name of Jesus Cathedral in Raleigh, North Carolina.
With the lack of Christian values in the world today, Sisk desires “something greater,” which she says she can tell is happening in the TLM.
Many TLM parishes saw an increase in attendance during the pandemic, as they were often the only churches open while many others shut their doors or held Masses outside. This struck some as controversial, if not disobedient to the local government. For others, it was a saving grace to have access to the sacraments.
The priests at Erin Hanson’s parish obtained permission from the local bishop to celebrate Mass all day, every day, with 10 parishioners at a time during the height of the COVID pandemic.
“We were being told by the world that church is not necessary,” says Hanson, a 39-year-old mother of three. “Our priest says, ‘No, that’s a lie. Our church is essential. Our salvation is essential. The sacraments are essential.’”
Andy Stevens, 52, came into the Church through the TLM, much to the surprise of his wife, Emma, who had been a practicing Catholic for many years. Andy was “very adamantly not going to become Catholic,” but was happy to help Emma with their children at Mass. It wasn’t until they attended a TLM that Andy began to think differently about the Church.
“He believed that you die and then there is nothing, and he never really spoke to me about becoming a Catholic,” says Emma, 48, who was pregnant with their seventh child at the time.
Andy noticed an intense focus among the worshippers, which he recognized as a “real presence of God” that he didn’t see anywhere else. After the birth of their 7th child, he joined the Church.
All 12 of the Stevens’ children prefer the TLM to the Novus Ordo.
Emma and Andy Stevens with their 12 children in Oxford, England.
“It’s a Mass of the ages,” says their eldest son, Ryan, 27. “I can feel the veil between heaven and earth palpably thinner.”
A native of Chicago, Adriel Gonzalez, 33, remembers attending the TLM as a child, which he did not particularly like. It was “very long, very boring,” and the people who went to the TLM were “very stiff and they could come off as judgmental” towards his family, he says.
Gonzalez, who also attended Mass in Spanish with his family, didn’t understand the differences among rites, since Chicago was a sort of “salad bowl, ethnically,” he says, and Mass was celebrated in many languages and forms.
He took a step back from faith for some time, he says, noting that he had a “respectability issue” with the Christianity he grew up with. He watched as some of his friends were either thoughtless in the way they practiced their faith, or were “on fire,” but lacked intentionality. When he did come back to the faith, it was through learning about the Church’s intellectual tradition.
He spent time in monasteries and Eastern Catholic parishes with the Divine Liturgy because there was “something so obviously ancient about it.” He decided to stay within the Roman rite with a preference for a reverent Novus Ordo.
When he moved to Ann Arbor, Michigan, Gonzalez committed to his neighborhood parish, which had a strong contingent of people who loved tradition in general. The parish instituted a TLM in the fall of 2020, when they started having Mass indoors again after the pandemic.
Hallie and Adriel Gonzalez.
“If I’m at a Latin Mass, I’m more likely to get a sense that this is a time-honored practice, something that has been honed over the millennia,” he says. “There is clearly a love affair going on here with the Lord that requires this much more elaborate song and dance.”
For Eric Matthews, the TLM feels a little like time travel.
“It could be medieval times, it could be the enlightenment period, it could be the early 1900s, and the experience is going to be so similar,” he says.
“I just feel like that’s that universal timeframe – not just the universal Church in 2021 – but the universal Church in almost any time period. We’re the only church that can claim that.”
What happens now?
The motu proprio caught Adriel Gonzalez’ attention. He sought clarity about whether his participation in the extraordinary form was, in fact, part of a divisive movement, or simply an expression of his faith.
If it was a movement, he wanted no part of it, he says.
“As far as I can tell, the Church considers the extraordinary form and the ordinary form equal and valid,” says Gonzalez. “Ideally, there should be no true difference between going to one or the other, outside of just preference. It shouldn’t constitute a completely different reality within Catholicism.”
With this understanding, Gonzalez says he resonated with some of the reasoning set forth in the motu proprio because it articulated that the celebration of the TLM was never intended to be a movement away from the Novus Ordo or Vatican II. Gonzalez also emphasized that the extraordinary form was never supposed to be a “superior” way of celebrating the Mass.
Gonzalez believes the Lord allowed the growth in the TLM “to help us to recover a love for liturgy, and to ask questions about what worship and liturgy looks like.” He would have preferred if what was good was kept and encouraged, and what was potentially dangerous “coaxed out and called out.”
Mater Misericordæ Catholic Church in Phoenix, Arizona. / Viet Truong
Erin Hanson, of Mater Misericordiæ, agrees.
“If [Pope Francis] does believe there is division between Novus Ordo and traditional Catholics, I don’t think he did anything to try to fix that division,” she says.
Hanson would like to know who the bishops are that Pope Francis consulted in making this decision, sharing that she doesn’t feel that there is any of the transparency needed for such a major document. If there are divisions, she says, she would like the opportunity to work on them in a different way.
“This isn’t going to be any less divisive if he causes a possible schism,” Hanson says.
According to the motu proprio and the accompanying letter, the TLM is not to be celebrated in diocesan churches or in new churches constructed for the purpose of the TLM, nor should new groups be established by the bishops. Left out of their parish churches, some are worried their only option to attend Mass will be in a recreation center or hotel ballroom.
Eric Matthews hopes that everyone is able to experience the extraordinary form at least once in their life so they can know that this is not about division.
“I can’t imagine someone going to the Latin Mass and saying, ‘This is creating disunity,’” he says. “There’s nothing to be afraid of with the Latin Mass. You’re just going to be surrounding yourself with people that really take it to heart.”
Maureen McKinley was home sick when her husband Matt found out about the motu proprio. He had taken the kids to a neighborhood park, where he ran into some friends who also attend Mater Misericordiæ. They asked if he had heard the news.
“I felt disgust at a document that pretends to say so much while actually saying so little and disregards the Church’s very long and rich tradition of careful legal documents,” Matt McKinley says.
Bishop Thomas Olmsted of Phoenix stated that the TLM may continue at Mater Misericordiæ, as well as in chapels, oratories, mission churches, non-parochial churches, and at seven other parishes in the diocese. Participation in the TLM and all of the activities of the parish are so important to the McKinleys that they are willing to move to another state or city should further restrictions be implemented.
For now, their family’s routine continues the same as before.
At the end of their day, the McKinleys pray a family rosary in front of their home altar, which has a Bible at the center, and an icon of Christ and a statue of the Virgin Mary. They eat dinner together, milk the goat again, and take care of their evening animal chores. After night prayer, the kids head off to bed, blessing themselves with holy water from the fonts mounted on the wall before they enter their bedroom.
“The life of the Church springs from this Mass,” Maureen says. “That’s why we’re here—not because the Latin Mass is archaic, but that it’s actually just so alive.”
Washington D.C., Jan 29, 2021 / 08:39 am (CNA).- Protecting vulnerable persons was a “bright spot” in the country’s COVID-19 pandemic response, the U.S. bishops’ pro-life chair said on the eve of the March for Life.
Archbishop Jose Gomez of Los Angeles. / Daniel Ibanez/CNA
Los Angeles, Calif., Aug 16, 2021 / 17:14 pm (CNA).
The Archdiocese of Los Angeles has said it is not providing religious exemption letters to individuals who object to receiving a vaccin… […]
66 Comments
There is good reason to believe that Vance will promote the pro-life cause as VP despite the recent politically expedient comments he made in support of access to the abortion pill. He campaigned hard against the abortion legalization initiative in Ohio last fall and has a perfect record on the issue as a Senator. He has not declared himself “pro-choice” and has made it clear that he wants judges that will not impose abortion by judicial fiat and opposes federal funding for it. He deserved to be called out, but his critics need to keep some perspective.
I’m hoping for the best also.
It’s very disappointing that more American voters are not on board as they should be on this human rights issue but Mr Vance is not our enemy. I think we can work with him.
In politics that’s the best you can hope for sometimes.
Part of my own story includes the chairman of my dissertation committee (1970s). A transparent fellow, formerly an anthropologist who had worked in the Afghanistan of the 1960s to reform the education system. In a small group around the coffee table, he switched tracks completely and confided:
“My wife is Catholic and I am Episcopalian…and I don’t really know if God talks [!] to people.” The ACHILLES HEEL of the entire secularist education system and worldview! Does God ever talk to people?
All to the point that the historical and even alarming event of the INCARNATION, Jesus Christ, is not just another a religious “expression.” But, rather, the self-disclosure (!) of the Triune God. Christians listen to “the Word made flesh.” And, Catholics are also converted to the sacramental Real Presence which/Who assembles the Church as the Mystical Body of Christ. More than a sola Scriptura congregation, or a synodal convener of some polyglot Worldreligion.
Moreover, in the reasonably distinct SECULAR DOMAIN of robust and political rough and tumble, however, it is quite enough to simply respect the universal and already inborn Natural Law. Beyond respect for the moral absolutes, the Catholic Social Teaching (CST) does offer added perspectives, but: “The Church has no models to present; models that are real and truly effective can only arise within the framework of different historical situations, through the efforts of all those who responsibly confront concrete problems in all their social, economic, political and cultural aspects, as these interact with one another” (Gaudium et Spes, n. 36). The CST is the negation of all ideology…
Plenty of room there for robust dialogue and negotiation on the means for communities to define and achieve their moral and complex ends.
The attentive reader will be able to spot the eyebrow-raising statements, in light of aligning oneself with a political platform that doesn’t merely wait for a better, politically possible reality in order to defend unborn human life, but has scrubbed it and actively allowed for the opposite. One may also notice that Sen. Vance has deleted statements defending the unborn from his website, all presumably for political expediency. Will we ever learn not to rush and promote public converts especially for their Catholicism, before they are allowed time to develop and/or consistently express doctrinal coherence? Or in the case of abortion, before they are aware of the need to express one’s “absolute personal opposition” (Pope John Paul II) when faced with political realities that make the Good “impossible” (St. Thomas Aquinas)
Daniel. Vance’s initials JD appear to be John Donald. His duplicitous adoration of his great leader comes with a signifcant historical flip.
Before and during his 3 years as a fledging US senator his hypocractical moment was when he fierecely disparaged and unCatholic like said…
he was a “never-Trump guy.” “the reason, ultimately, that I am not … is because I think that (Trump) is the most-raw expression of a massive finger pointed at other people.”
Trump is “reprehensible” and an “idiot.”
In another deleted tweet following the release of the “Access Hollywood” tape on which Trump said fame enabled him to grope women, Vance wrote: “Fellow Christians, everyone is watching us when we apologize for this man. Lord help us.”
Trump was “unfit for our nation’s highest office.”
“I’m a Never Trump guy,” Vance said in an interview with Charlie Rose in 2016, according to Politico. “I never liked him.”
Vance also deleted a tweet saying he found Trump reprehensible from October 2016. “My god what an idiot.”
Vance has not mentoned his support for Project 2025. The so called GOP “platform”. If you haven’t read it you should. The most egrious part is “Install A Totalitarian Administration”. A monarchy!
Which must mean that, per Harris, Biden did “praise racists” opposed to busing, and therefore her attitude could not evolve within the political reality of assuming the office, and her support of Biden has ulterior motives, similar to Vance/Trump, correct?
Grieving the departure of the public defense of the unborn, for political “reality”, does not equate to therefore supporting the Progressive celebration of abortion as emancipation, the enabling of the mutilation of gender dysphoria subjects, etc.
The “lesser of two evils” remains an applicable description of the situation.
Mr. Morgan, I’m partial to constitutional monarchies. It would save us the election circuses we endure every 4 years. But that’s not what Donald Trump or any other GOP candidate has in mind. And again, please don’t go down that rabbit hole.
Mr. Vance was correct that many people thought of Donald Trump as a giant “finger” at the elites. And that’s still true. But after his term in office he earned more credit than just a protest against the status quo.
If you venture down that TDS rabbit hole please say hello to my friend from grade school. She’s been down there incommunicado since last November.
🙂
Project 2025 is not any part of the Trump platform, per Trump himself. Once again you are simply spouting talking points.
Morgan D brings into discussion a very significant set of issues regarding his concerns about Project 2025. I think it is less that adequate to argue as Michael Caldwell and Athanasius have done in providing a one or two sentence rebuttal that is essentially dismissive of Morgan D’s stated concerns. The Heritage Foundation has been around for decades and were major players in policy direction for the Regan Administration therefore thy have influence in the heavy hitting end of the spectrum of influence. Secondly Project 2025 was authored almost entirely by individuals who were at the apex level of Pres Trump’s admin when in office and are likely to hold positions high up in Pres Trump’s admin if elected. Several spoke at the convention.
Secondly it is accurate to acknowledge that together with recent rulings of the Supreme Court coupled with some relevant Project 2025 proposals, the checks and balances on executive power are effectively removed. The posibility that foundation principles of the Constitution become open to the Presidents interpretation seems a likely outcome. The Republic then has the potential to move in the direction of that of an Emperor. Surely this is worthy of careful, informed and impartial examination.
Donald Trump pays little attention to the Establishment. There are some good people in the Heritage Foundation but I doubt Mr. Trump pays a great deal of attention to them either.
Americans voted for President Trump the first time around because they wanted a disruptor against the Establishment and status quo. Not someone who took instructions from a Reagan era think tank.
I personally wish Donald Trump would pay a little more heed to folks at places like the Heritage Foundation but that’s not who he is.
You are concerned about nothing, and you are mindlessly parroting DNC talking points here. At his Grand Rapids, MI speech, Trump clearly stated that he does not endorse or support Project 2025. He would know, after all. You are simply spreading lies, and that’s not appropriate. One cannot have legitimate concerns about something that isn’t legitimate. It needs no further elaboration.
It seems to me upon further investigation that Project 2025 is very relevant to this election cycle and the political agenda Trump intends to pursue from, as he has often mentioned, from Day One. To dismiss Morgan’s point by offering Trumps recent statements of distancing is not an acceptable rebuttal.
I will begin with this observation:
Kevin Roberts, the Heritage Foundation president and the architect of Project 2025, the conservative thinktank’s road map for a second Trump presidency, has close ties and receives regular spiritual guidance from an Opus Dei.
Trump has repeatedly referenced the Heritage Foundation in recent years and particularly in the aftermath of his 2016 victory.
Trump knows personally most of the major contributors to the document because they worked in his administration. The authors include Trump’s former Cabinet secretaries, top White House officials and senior aides — including former Trump appointees to EPA, the Interior Department and the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission. Thomas Homan, former acting director of the US immigration and customs enforcement agency, responsible for the disastrous tactic of separating children from their families is a major contributor.
The list goes on.
What is of some concern at present is are the recent actions of the Supreme Court. A Supreme Court Justice’s wife flying the US flag upside down…. here we have another example of the influence of Opus Dei. Leonard Leo is a conservative activist who has led the Republican mission to install the rightwing majority in the supreme court and finances many of the groups signed on to Project 2025.
[Nov. 18, 2023, 6:17 AM GMT+11 / Updated Nov. 18, 2023, 10:18 AM GMT+11
By Katherine Doyle]
We can see that the Heritage Foundation are heavy hitters in the Republican Parties history:
Major input into President Regans policy suit.
Engaged in restructuring Iraq with policy and personnel.
The Trump Campaign’s other formal policy document Agenda 47 has many close parallels to Project 2025
I am of the opinion that the agenda outlined by Project 2025 is central to Trumps agenda and will be perused with haste from Day One if he is elected.
You write that James Donald Vance ‘adores’ Trump? Seriously, dude, you need to get out more. Any Catholic worth his salt understands that adoration is directed to God alone. Not even the BVM gets it from us.
As Pope John Paul II indicated regarding a situation where it is not possible to overturn or completely defeat a law allowing abortion, “an elected official, whose absolute personal opposition to procured abortion was well known, could licitly support proposals aimed at limiting the harm done by such a law and at lessening its negative consequences at the level of general opinion and public morality”(EV 73; also CPL 4). (Source: Priests for Life “Voters Guide for Serious Catholics”)
Trump/Vance are doing exactly what Pope John Paul II has acknowledged as “licit:” “supporting proposals aimed at limiting the harm done” by abortion laws that they cannot fully undo at this time and expect to get elected in this political climate in America.
The truth (if we are willing to face it) is that we are living in a Constitutional Republic that is fading away. The moral character of the country is such that it cannot be sustained. I encourage readers to convince me otherwise (please don’t make appeals based on pure sentimentality).
Having now been behooved, I thank you for this link…especially Vance’s criticism about corporate boardrooms and the culture wars.
Recalling, here, that in 2015 corporate America formally positioned itself in favor of gay “marriage”. As broadly reported and rewarded in the media, AT&T and Verizon, Dow Chemical, Bank of America, General Electric, Coca-Cola and Pepsi, Google, Apple, Facebook and Microsoft, and the San Francisco Giants, were among nearly four hundred corporations and business organizations that weighed in with probably duplicate amicus briefs filed with the U.S. Supreme Court. Together they orchestrated their dollar-sign argument for a constitutional right to the oxymoron same sex “marriage.” The reason: stock market numbers might benefit (very, very marginally) from spending patterns (one billion dollars: sounds big, but not even an infinitesimal fraction of the $20 Trillion annual GNP).
In this hostile takeover by the tribal LGBTQ religion, the empty-suit business world gave an entirely new meaning to the term “bottom line.”
I assume the readership here are aware that JD Vance’s entire career and upward trajectory has been financially supported and facilitated by Peter Thiel, who in 2017 married his long term partner Mat Danzeisen.
I assume the readership above IS aware that Mother Teresa received $1.25 million from one Charles Keating, a major player in the savings and loan debacle of the 1980s. So? That Vance’s campaign may have taken money from a man practicing homosexuality proves what? Nothing!
I once inadvertently gave $1000 to Francis’ Peter Pence Collection. That in no way means that I agree with its leader or its goals. I entirely disagree with the idea of structured global charity drives; funds have sometimes been proven subject to dishonorable misappropriation. I do not particularly like the personality and leadership style of Francis. And many organizations and persons that I do approve don’t receive a dime from me. So what!?
My first point would be to say that such association when applying to a Democrat candidate would elicit much opposition from many here. So this situation at least indicates the existence of confirmation bias.
I did not specify what this financial and other support for JD Vance did prove but proof is likely not the appropriate word here. The support implies a common agenda, overt or hidden. The relationship gives Peter Theil some influence simply because when such consistent and significant support is given it is wise to assume something is expected in return. My main point would be this is worth exploration. JD Vance is direct in line to become POTUS if Trump is elected and he is a relative newcomer with limited experience. There surely would be many more qualified for the position of potentially leading the nation. Personally I am somewhat mystified by Trumps choice of VP.
Certainly people with diverse views on some issues can find common ground on others. Why not?
You need to consider which issues are being promoted. That’s what counts.
To John Allan, wondering about intersecting interests of Thiel, Vance, and Trump, see Financial Times:
If he is truly converted to Catholicism, his first order of business is to apply Catholic principles of justice and compassion to the plight of the Palestinians.
Unfortunately, like Trump, he greenlights the ongoing murderous ethnic cleansing in Gaza.
Chris Albrecht: There was no killing until the Palestinians in Gaza invaded, raped, killed and kidnapped innocent civilian Israeli, American and other nationals who were minding their own business. It’s no different than the invasion of our Southern border by illegals who come here and rape, murder and bring their Fentanyl to sell to our children. Your version of reality is woefully warped.
If Vance did anything like what you want, he wouldn’t be a senator let alone vice-presidential candidate. If trimming your sails is essential when it comes to abortion, it is even more so when discussing foreign policy in the Middle East. You have to rhetorically bend the knee to Israel if you are to survive in American politics. BTW, the same principle applies in Europe as well. Even Orban sides with Israel. The Israelis have committed outrageous injustices and brutalities against the Palestinians. That doesn’t mean that the conduct of the Palestinians has been in any way admirable – it has not been. The relevant point is that the US unjustifiably and, contrary to its national interests, supports Israel to the hilt. Vance, despite some his almost obligatory comments, is a voice of reason and peace through strength on international affairs.
Of course, there is a problem of israeli dominion over american political speech, but resistance must begin somewhere, and we need moral principles and a more than natural courage. I would point out as an example of standing up to Israel Rep. Thomas Massie–who explained on Tucker Carlson’s program that every republican and democrat has an assigned AIPAC handler to make sure that they submit to Israel. Massie stands up to Israel and wins. It can be done.
As Joan of Arc said: fight! God will provide the victory!
A fine Catholic columnist, Joseph Sobran, once wrote:
An “anti-semite” used to mean someone who hated Jews.
Now it means someone whom Jews hate.
This quote is relevant to today’s controversies.
Joseph Sobran was a brilliant writer and I always looked forward to his articles.
Perhaps his illness played a part in his going off the rails. It was a shame.
May he rest in peace.
Mrs. Cracker: Sobran did not “go off the rails,” rather he had the courage to touch the “third rail” of American politics: the issue of Jewish/Israeli control over what constitutes acceptable political discourse. This control is destroying the American Republic.
Massie is terrific, but he is neither a senator nor a vice-presidential candidate. Also, he merely objected to the aid package to Israel, largely on the grounds that, with our towering national debt, we should not be giving aid to a First World nation. Of course, that was enough to put him in the crosshairs of AIPAC. I am sure he would offer much deeper criticisms of Israel and its lobby among friends. The same is true of Vance, I am confident.
I hope that you are right and I have not given up on Vance, but so far he looks like a neo-con who has simply decided to pivot a half-step, because of the many failures of the neo-con agenda. thus it is easy now to oppose aid to Ukraine or criticize the now distant Iraqi invasion.
But he argued recently for “hitting Iran hard” (that is, with violence,–and he approved of Trump’s murder of Solemani)
and “focusing on China” as the main enemy, and, by implication, he continues to press ardently for an “endlosung” for the Palestinians (i.e. the complete removal of Palestinians from that region of the middle east).
It is a mere shift of emphasis, tactically and optically necessary.
Same agenda–America as Israel’s golem, hater of dem Ay-rabs and dem Muslims, and the overweight bully on the world playground.
Re: the Palestinian issue. if a person votes for an arms and aid to israel package, *knowing full well that it will be used to wage war on the civilians of Gaza–he is complicit.* God will hold Vance accountable.
But pray that God may amend him–and Trump.
It is not too late. “The heart of the King is in the hand of the Lord” (Proverbs?)
All it takes to end the war is to for Hamas to surrender and free the captives. At least one or twwo kidnapped victims are American citizens. Hopefully if Trump is elected we will hear good news from the Middle East. Sort of like when Reagan took office and our citizens were being held by Iran.
For all intents and purposes it’s Iran all over again today.
Okay. Why don’t you fill out the appropriate form to put him there? You don’t have it? Well, back to school with you then. September is only a month away.
The Palestinians who committed and/or supported the October 7 massacre, have no just call for our support. They are thenauthors of their own fates. Hamas hates Christians as much as it does Jews. It is an arm of the Muslim world domination culture.
De above – It’s early days. I think people are putting a lot of expectations on Vance.
I am disappointed in the lack of nuance in his position on mifepristone. As I understand it, the Supreme Court declined to hear the case because the presenters didn’t have standing, i.e. they lacked the necessary qualifications to present the case. That’s not the same as approving mifepristone.
Yes, Cleo that’s what I understood also.
And currently, each state has the right to restrict abortifacient drugs. So both chemical & surgical feticides can be banned state by state.
Further to De above – Fr. De Souza has an article on Vance’s Catholicism today, July 19, in The Catholic Thing.
I think Fr. De Souza’s assessment is more tentative, wait-and-see than I’m getting from many commentators.
This is the time for Catholic thought to grow. Morality must be seen in terms of an ascent towards transcendence that can be realized only by the free and mature individual. This implies both a kind of gnosis by which conflicting transcendental invitations are experienced and a conscious synthesizing of the opposites. Epistemology and politics are challenged to expand. This can be seen as where Catholic thought must go rather than where it has been.
Frank Ruppert
You’re insight is enlightening, appreciated and spoken truthfully. In summation, we are all a work in progress in our search for the Wisdon, Knowledge, Understanding of God, His Merciful Love and Abundance of Grace.
i certainly hope biden does not get in. i cant believe anybody would actually want a hair-sniffing groomer to be in the white house. he should be in prison.
Mrs. Cracker above – Thanks for the confirmation of my understanding of the Supreme Court’s action on mefipristone. I read an article explaining it but haven’t been able to re-find it.
I wasn’t clear that each state could ban abortifacient drugs. Perhaps we will eventually hear that from Vance. “Hope springs eternal”.
Got it. Vance has proven his Catholic allegiance at Napa. His conversion to the faith is an example for others. But, his litany of disparagements against Trump proves he isn’t quite there yet. His acceptance of Project 2025, the Trump, not GOP “platform” shows he is an extremist. 2025 is a plan to OVERHALL GOVERNMENT. Paul Dans is the director along with Trumps inner-circle advisers. Ben Carson, Ken Cuccinelli, Rick Dearborn, Jennifer Hazelton, Peter Navarro, Steven Miller… Read it.
Every election cycle we get fearmongering talking points like “Project 2025”, January 6th, Christian Nationalism,etc.
There are good people in the Heritage Foundation but President Trump doesn’t take marching orders from them.
Maybe the crowd who cant stop attacking Trump and Vance for not being even MORE pro-life, should direct their energies toward the current Pope. He appears to have a lukewarm approach to the subject. He has provided a smiling warm welcome to those DEM politicians who have given public full throated support of PRO-abortion policy loud and clear. ( Here I mean his welcome to Biden, Pelosi and Whoopie Goldberg, etc, who have met the Pope in person.) NO American politician has any obligation at all to support a pro-life agenda, although many do. Its unfortunate but true that many who voice pro-life support end up voted out of office. If they had an opportunity to remain IN office, they could have helped enact MANY policies which would have assisted our poor and marginalized citizens. Voicing extreme pro-life legislation will almost guarantee they will be voted out of office and then able to accomplish NOTHING. Failing to vote for politicians who appear to be friendly to the pro-life agenda in at least SOME measure is cutting off your nose to spite your race. Like it or not, compromise MUST be used on this topic. Otherwise you will not even get the “half a loaf”. You will in fact get NONE. How on earth does that help anyone or save ANY babies??? Progress is most often made in increments, not in one fell swoop. If you cant see the difference between a party which supports abortion til the day of birth, and one which might allow some rare exceptions but does not support 3rd trimester abortion at all, do us all a favor and stay at home election day.
LJ above – Thanks for your comments.
The battle continues and you’re right, Pope Francis’ welcome mat isn’t helping. And he doesn’t have the problem (excuse) of having to win power.
I think in the first place it’s not clear if you meant to write vile but you put “vial”.
If you meant “vial disparagements” it would be an image of disparagements lumped into a sort of container. Like pot and kettle in a combined metaphorical sense.
If you meant “vile” then you’re emphasizing the disparaging and that you think Trump doesn’t deserve that. Pot and kettle in traditional metaphor.
Trump has disappointed A LOT OF PEOPLE and I am not surprised it isn’t going over well. He’s also multiplying his overlaying of his self-management, eg., as we just saw, “I’m going to tell you what I experienced with that bullet and then I never want to have to talk about it again.” Since when there’s Presidential immunity for that?
Some tenants pay rent and suddenly they’re never accountable again. Trump wants to live in your head rent free (not my metaphor but it’s spectacular! at least it’s not VP Harris!) and then even with exempting himself from paying rent he wants to then be unaccountable! Haha good one!
John Allan,
Every election cycle either party comes up with scare tactics and hype. Project 2025 is just the latest one for the DNC. I haven’t seen it getting much traction lately so they probably have other plans in the works to distract voters with
And Opus Dei is not a powerful, sinister organization. That’s more spin.
There is good reason to believe that Vance will promote the pro-life cause as VP despite the recent politically expedient comments he made in support of access to the abortion pill. He campaigned hard against the abortion legalization initiative in Ohio last fall and has a perfect record on the issue as a Senator. He has not declared himself “pro-choice” and has made it clear that he wants judges that will not impose abortion by judicial fiat and opposes federal funding for it. He deserved to be called out, but his critics need to keep some perspective.
I’m hoping for the best also.
It’s very disappointing that more American voters are not on board as they should be on this human rights issue but Mr Vance is not our enemy. I think we can work with him.
In politics that’s the best you can hope for sometimes.
I agree.
Idea for a t-shirt – “I’m voting for the guy with the pierced ear”
Dude, that’s an awesome idea. Hilarious comment.
Part of my own story includes the chairman of my dissertation committee (1970s). A transparent fellow, formerly an anthropologist who had worked in the Afghanistan of the 1960s to reform the education system. In a small group around the coffee table, he switched tracks completely and confided:
“My wife is Catholic and I am Episcopalian…and I don’t really know if God talks [!] to people.” The ACHILLES HEEL of the entire secularist education system and worldview! Does God ever talk to people?
All to the point that the historical and even alarming event of the INCARNATION, Jesus Christ, is not just another a religious “expression.” But, rather, the self-disclosure (!) of the Triune God. Christians listen to “the Word made flesh.” And, Catholics are also converted to the sacramental Real Presence which/Who assembles the Church as the Mystical Body of Christ. More than a sola Scriptura congregation, or a synodal convener of some polyglot Worldreligion.
Moreover, in the reasonably distinct SECULAR DOMAIN of robust and political rough and tumble, however, it is quite enough to simply respect the universal and already inborn Natural Law. Beyond respect for the moral absolutes, the Catholic Social Teaching (CST) does offer added perspectives, but: “The Church has no models to present; models that are real and truly effective can only arise within the framework of different historical situations, through the efforts of all those who responsibly confront concrete problems in all their social, economic, political and cultural aspects, as these interact with one another” (Gaudium et Spes, n. 36). The CST is the negation of all ideology…
Plenty of room there for robust dialogue and negotiation on the means for communities to define and achieve their moral and complex ends.
The attentive reader will be able to spot the eyebrow-raising statements, in light of aligning oneself with a political platform that doesn’t merely wait for a better, politically possible reality in order to defend unborn human life, but has scrubbed it and actively allowed for the opposite. One may also notice that Sen. Vance has deleted statements defending the unborn from his website, all presumably for political expediency. Will we ever learn not to rush and promote public converts especially for their Catholicism, before they are allowed time to develop and/or consistently express doctrinal coherence? Or in the case of abortion, before they are aware of the need to express one’s “absolute personal opposition” (Pope John Paul II) when faced with political realities that make the Good “impossible” (St. Thomas Aquinas)
Daniel. Vance’s initials JD appear to be John Donald. His duplicitous adoration of his great leader comes with a signifcant historical flip.
Before and during his 3 years as a fledging US senator his hypocractical moment was when he fierecely disparaged and unCatholic like said…
he was a “never-Trump guy.” “the reason, ultimately, that I am not … is because I think that (Trump) is the most-raw expression of a massive finger pointed at other people.”
Trump is “reprehensible” and an “idiot.”
In another deleted tweet following the release of the “Access Hollywood” tape on which Trump said fame enabled him to grope women, Vance wrote: “Fellow Christians, everyone is watching us when we apologize for this man. Lord help us.”
Trump was “unfit for our nation’s highest office.”
“I’m a Never Trump guy,” Vance said in an interview with Charlie Rose in 2016, according to Politico. “I never liked him.”
Vance also deleted a tweet saying he found Trump reprehensible from October 2016. “My god what an idiot.”
Vance has not mentoned his support for Project 2025. The so called GOP “platform”. If you haven’t read it you should. The most egrious part is “Install A Totalitarian Administration”. A monarchy!
Which must mean that, per Harris, Biden did “praise racists” opposed to busing, and therefore her attitude could not evolve within the political reality of assuming the office, and her support of Biden has ulterior motives, similar to Vance/Trump, correct?
Grieving the departure of the public defense of the unborn, for political “reality”, does not equate to therefore supporting the Progressive celebration of abortion as emancipation, the enabling of the mutilation of gender dysphoria subjects, etc.
The “lesser of two evils” remains an applicable description of the situation.
Mr. Morgan, I’m partial to constitutional monarchies. It would save us the election circuses we endure every 4 years. But that’s not what Donald Trump or any other GOP candidate has in mind. And again, please don’t go down that rabbit hole.
Mr. Vance was correct that many people thought of Donald Trump as a giant “finger” at the elites. And that’s still true. But after his term in office he earned more credit than just a protest against the status quo.
If you venture down that TDS rabbit hole please say hello to my friend from grade school. She’s been down there incommunicado since last November.
🙂
Balderdash on the 2025 GOP Platform.
I’m not sure if your are calling Project 2025 bunkum, or my article?
Thanks.
Project 2025 is not any part of the Trump platform, per Trump himself. Once again you are simply spouting talking points.
Morgan D brings into discussion a very significant set of issues regarding his concerns about Project 2025. I think it is less that adequate to argue as Michael Caldwell and Athanasius have done in providing a one or two sentence rebuttal that is essentially dismissive of Morgan D’s stated concerns. The Heritage Foundation has been around for decades and were major players in policy direction for the Regan Administration therefore thy have influence in the heavy hitting end of the spectrum of influence. Secondly Project 2025 was authored almost entirely by individuals who were at the apex level of Pres Trump’s admin when in office and are likely to hold positions high up in Pres Trump’s admin if elected. Several spoke at the convention.
Secondly it is accurate to acknowledge that together with recent rulings of the Supreme Court coupled with some relevant Project 2025 proposals, the checks and balances on executive power are effectively removed. The posibility that foundation principles of the Constitution become open to the Presidents interpretation seems a likely outcome. The Republic then has the potential to move in the direction of that of an Emperor. Surely this is worthy of careful, informed and impartial examination.
Donald Trump pays little attention to the Establishment. There are some good people in the Heritage Foundation but I doubt Mr. Trump pays a great deal of attention to them either.
Americans voted for President Trump the first time around because they wanted a disruptor against the Establishment and status quo. Not someone who took instructions from a Reagan era think tank.
I personally wish Donald Trump would pay a little more heed to folks at places like the Heritage Foundation but that’s not who he is.
You are concerned about nothing, and you are mindlessly parroting DNC talking points here. At his Grand Rapids, MI speech, Trump clearly stated that he does not endorse or support Project 2025. He would know, after all. You are simply spreading lies, and that’s not appropriate. One cannot have legitimate concerns about something that isn’t legitimate. It needs no further elaboration.
It seems to me upon further investigation that Project 2025 is very relevant to this election cycle and the political agenda Trump intends to pursue from, as he has often mentioned, from Day One. To dismiss Morgan’s point by offering Trumps recent statements of distancing is not an acceptable rebuttal.
I will begin with this observation:
Kevin Roberts, the Heritage Foundation president and the architect of Project 2025, the conservative thinktank’s road map for a second Trump presidency, has close ties and receives regular spiritual guidance from an Opus Dei.
Trump has repeatedly referenced the Heritage Foundation in recent years and particularly in the aftermath of his 2016 victory.
Trump knows personally most of the major contributors to the document because they worked in his administration. The authors include Trump’s former Cabinet secretaries, top White House officials and senior aides — including former Trump appointees to EPA, the Interior Department and the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission. Thomas Homan, former acting director of the US immigration and customs enforcement agency, responsible for the disastrous tactic of separating children from their families is a major contributor.
The list goes on.
What is of some concern at present is are the recent actions of the Supreme Court. A Supreme Court Justice’s wife flying the US flag upside down…. here we have another example of the influence of Opus Dei. Leonard Leo is a conservative activist who has led the Republican mission to install the rightwing majority in the supreme court and finances many of the groups signed on to Project 2025.
[Nov. 18, 2023, 6:17 AM GMT+11 / Updated Nov. 18, 2023, 10:18 AM GMT+11
By Katherine Doyle]
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/donations-surged-groups-linked-conservative-project-2025-rcna125638
We can see that the Heritage Foundation are heavy hitters in the Republican Parties history:
Major input into President Regans policy suit.
Engaged in restructuring Iraq with policy and personnel.
The Trump Campaign’s other formal policy document Agenda 47 has many close parallels to Project 2025
I am of the opinion that the agenda outlined by Project 2025 is central to Trumps agenda and will be perused with haste from Day One if he is elected.
You write that James Donald Vance ‘adores’ Trump? Seriously, dude, you need to get out more. Any Catholic worth his salt understands that adoration is directed to God alone. Not even the BVM gets it from us.
Iv’e been to a DUDE ranck though. And, I got plenty of fresh air. Don’t follow Trump by using vial disparagements. I do not.
Thanks.
“Don’t follow Trump by using vial disparagements.”
Says the guy who disparages Trump at every turn. Pot meet kettle, etc.
I am actually concerned that too much is being made of Vance’s Catholicism.
Cleo, Tmthat’s an odd comment for a Catholic to make (forgive me if I assumed you are a Catholic but are not).
As Pope John Paul II indicated regarding a situation where it is not possible to overturn or completely defeat a law allowing abortion, “an elected official, whose absolute personal opposition to procured abortion was well known, could licitly support proposals aimed at limiting the harm done by such a law and at lessening its negative consequences at the level of general opinion and public morality”(EV 73; also CPL 4). (Source: Priests for Life “Voters Guide for Serious Catholics”)
Trump/Vance are doing exactly what Pope John Paul II has acknowledged as “licit:” “supporting proposals aimed at limiting the harm done” by abortion laws that they cannot fully undo at this time and expect to get elected in this political climate in America.
The truth (if we are willing to face it) is that we are living in a Constitutional Republic that is fading away. The moral character of the country is such that it cannot be sustained. I encourage readers to convince me otherwise (please don’t make appeals based on pure sentimentality).
It would behoove my fellow Catholics to listen to an interview with J.D. Vance at the NAPA Institute Conference three years ago. Here goes…
https://youtu.be/Mhgz-03M-7w?si=c96QHVecr9guIf35
Having now been behooved, I thank you for this link…especially Vance’s criticism about corporate boardrooms and the culture wars.
Recalling, here, that in 2015 corporate America formally positioned itself in favor of gay “marriage”. As broadly reported and rewarded in the media, AT&T and Verizon, Dow Chemical, Bank of America, General Electric, Coca-Cola and Pepsi, Google, Apple, Facebook and Microsoft, and the San Francisco Giants, were among nearly four hundred corporations and business organizations that weighed in with probably duplicate amicus briefs filed with the U.S. Supreme Court. Together they orchestrated their dollar-sign argument for a constitutional right to the oxymoron same sex “marriage.” The reason: stock market numbers might benefit (very, very marginally) from spending patterns (one billion dollars: sounds big, but not even an infinitesimal fraction of the $20 Trillion annual GNP).
In this hostile takeover by the tribal LGBTQ religion, the empty-suit business world gave an entirely new meaning to the term “bottom line.”
I assume the readership here are aware that JD Vance’s entire career and upward trajectory has been financially supported and facilitated by Peter Thiel, who in 2017 married his long term partner Mat Danzeisen.
Many of us have worked for employers or corporations that differed with us ideologically or politically. How does that signify?
I assume the readership above IS aware that Mother Teresa received $1.25 million from one Charles Keating, a major player in the savings and loan debacle of the 1980s. So? That Vance’s campaign may have taken money from a man practicing homosexuality proves what? Nothing!
I once inadvertently gave $1000 to Francis’ Peter Pence Collection. That in no way means that I agree with its leader or its goals. I entirely disagree with the idea of structured global charity drives; funds have sometimes been proven subject to dishonorable misappropriation. I do not particularly like the personality and leadership style of Francis. And many organizations and persons that I do approve don’t receive a dime from me. So what!?
My first point would be to say that such association when applying to a Democrat candidate would elicit much opposition from many here. So this situation at least indicates the existence of confirmation bias.
I did not specify what this financial and other support for JD Vance did prove but proof is likely not the appropriate word here. The support implies a common agenda, overt or hidden. The relationship gives Peter Theil some influence simply because when such consistent and significant support is given it is wise to assume something is expected in return. My main point would be this is worth exploration. JD Vance is direct in line to become POTUS if Trump is elected and he is a relative newcomer with limited experience. There surely would be many more qualified for the position of potentially leading the nation. Personally I am somewhat mystified by Trumps choice of VP.
Certainly people with diverse views on some issues can find common ground on others. Why not?
You need to consider which issues are being promoted. That’s what counts.
To John Allan, wondering about intersecting interests of Thiel, Vance, and Trump, see Financial Times:
http://www.ft.com/content/408fb864-5831-4b1d-beef-fd1966b3beed
If he is truly converted to Catholicism, his first order of business is to apply Catholic principles of justice and compassion to the plight of the Palestinians.
Unfortunately, like Trump, he greenlights the ongoing murderous ethnic cleansing in Gaza.
Chris Albrecht: There was no killing until the Palestinians in Gaza invaded, raped, killed and kidnapped innocent civilian Israeli, American and other nationals who were minding their own business. It’s no different than the invasion of our Southern border by illegals who come here and rape, murder and bring their Fentanyl to sell to our children. Your version of reality is woefully warped.
Thank you
If Vance did anything like what you want, he wouldn’t be a senator let alone vice-presidential candidate. If trimming your sails is essential when it comes to abortion, it is even more so when discussing foreign policy in the Middle East. You have to rhetorically bend the knee to Israel if you are to survive in American politics. BTW, the same principle applies in Europe as well. Even Orban sides with Israel. The Israelis have committed outrageous injustices and brutalities against the Palestinians. That doesn’t mean that the conduct of the Palestinians has been in any way admirable – it has not been. The relevant point is that the US unjustifiably and, contrary to its national interests, supports Israel to the hilt. Vance, despite some his almost obligatory comments, is a voice of reason and peace through strength on international affairs.
Of course, there is a problem of israeli dominion over american political speech, but resistance must begin somewhere, and we need moral principles and a more than natural courage. I would point out as an example of standing up to Israel Rep. Thomas Massie–who explained on Tucker Carlson’s program that every republican and democrat has an assigned AIPAC handler to make sure that they submit to Israel. Massie stands up to Israel and wins. It can be done.
As Joan of Arc said: fight! God will provide the victory!
Chris Albrecht. Who should listen to an anti-semite?
A fine Catholic columnist, Joseph Sobran, once wrote:
An “anti-semite” used to mean someone who hated Jews.
Now it means someone whom Jews hate.
This quote is relevant to today’s controversies.
Joseph Sobran was a brilliant writer and I always looked forward to his articles.
Perhaps his illness played a part in his going off the rails. It was a shame.
May he rest in peace.
Mrs. Cracker: Sobran did not “go off the rails,” rather he had the courage to touch the “third rail” of American politics: the issue of Jewish/Israeli control over what constitutes acceptable political discourse. This control is destroying the American Republic.
Massie is terrific, but he is neither a senator nor a vice-presidential candidate. Also, he merely objected to the aid package to Israel, largely on the grounds that, with our towering national debt, we should not be giving aid to a First World nation. Of course, that was enough to put him in the crosshairs of AIPAC. I am sure he would offer much deeper criticisms of Israel and its lobby among friends. The same is true of Vance, I am confident.
I hope that you are right and I have not given up on Vance, but so far he looks like a neo-con who has simply decided to pivot a half-step, because of the many failures of the neo-con agenda. thus it is easy now to oppose aid to Ukraine or criticize the now distant Iraqi invasion.
But he argued recently for “hitting Iran hard” (that is, with violence,–and he approved of Trump’s murder of Solemani)
and “focusing on China” as the main enemy, and, by implication, he continues to press ardently for an “endlosung” for the Palestinians (i.e. the complete removal of Palestinians from that region of the middle east).
It is a mere shift of emphasis, tactically and optically necessary.
Same agenda–America as Israel’s golem, hater of dem Ay-rabs and dem Muslims, and the overweight bully on the world playground.
Re: the Palestinian issue. if a person votes for an arms and aid to israel package, *knowing full well that it will be used to wage war on the civilians of Gaza–he is complicit.* God will hold Vance accountable.
But pray that God may amend him–and Trump.
It is not too late. “The heart of the King is in the hand of the Lord” (Proverbs?)
All it takes to end the war is to for Hamas to surrender and free the captives. At least one or twwo kidnapped victims are American citizens. Hopefully if Trump is elected we will hear good news from the Middle East. Sort of like when Reagan took office and our citizens were being held by Iran.
For all intents and purposes it’s Iran all over again today.
trump should be in prison.
Okay. Why don’t you fill out the appropriate form to put him there? You don’t have it? Well, back to school with you then. September is only a month away.
The Palestinians who committed and/or supported the October 7 massacre, have no just call for our support. They are thenauthors of their own fates. Hamas hates Christians as much as it does Jews. It is an arm of the Muslim world domination culture.
I doubt Vance will save us.
No one who is truly Christian would expect anyone but Christ to save us. Only Christ can save us from our own individual wantoness.
De above – It’s early days. I think people are putting a lot of expectations on Vance.
I am disappointed in the lack of nuance in his position on mifepristone. As I understand it, the Supreme Court declined to hear the case because the presenters didn’t have standing, i.e. they lacked the necessary qualifications to present the case. That’s not the same as approving mifepristone.
Yes, Cleo that’s what I understood also.
And currently, each state has the right to restrict abortifacient drugs. So both chemical & surgical feticides can be banned state by state.
Further to De above – Fr. De Souza has an article on Vance’s Catholicism today, July 19, in The Catholic Thing.
I think Fr. De Souza’s assessment is more tentative, wait-and-see than I’m getting from many commentators.
This is the time for Catholic thought to grow. Morality must be seen in terms of an ascent towards transcendence that can be realized only by the free and mature individual. This implies both a kind of gnosis by which conflicting transcendental invitations are experienced and a conscious synthesizing of the opposites. Epistemology and politics are challenged to expand. This can be seen as where Catholic thought must go rather than where it has been.
Frank Ruppert
You’re insight is enlightening, appreciated and spoken truthfully. In summation, we are all a work in progress in our search for the Wisdon, Knowledge, Understanding of God, His Merciful Love and Abundance of Grace.
i certainly hope trump does not get in. i cant believe anybody would actually want a felon to be in the white house. he should be in prison.
i certainly hope biden does not get in. i cant believe anybody would actually want a hair-sniffing groomer to be in the white house. he should be in prison.
Holy Scripture says: “Put not your trust in princes.” I’m sure this applies to Vice-Princes, too.
Mrs. Cracker above – Thanks for the confirmation of my understanding of the Supreme Court’s action on mefipristone. I read an article explaining it but haven’t been able to re-find it.
I wasn’t clear that each state could ban abortifacient drugs. Perhaps we will eventually hear that from Vance. “Hope springs eternal”.
Abortifacient drugs are a controlled substance in our state Cleo.
Got it. Vance has proven his Catholic allegiance at Napa. His conversion to the faith is an example for others. But, his litany of disparagements against Trump proves he isn’t quite there yet. His acceptance of Project 2025, the Trump, not GOP “platform” shows he is an extremist. 2025 is a plan to OVERHALL GOVERNMENT. Paul Dans is the director along with Trumps inner-circle advisers. Ben Carson, Ken Cuccinelli, Rick Dearborn, Jennifer Hazelton, Peter Navarro, Steven Miller… Read it.
https://democracyforward.org/the-peoples-guide-to-project-2025/
Thanks.
Every election cycle we get fearmongering talking points like “Project 2025”, January 6th, Christian Nationalism,etc.
There are good people in the Heritage Foundation but President Trump doesn’t take marching orders from them.
Maybe the crowd who cant stop attacking Trump and Vance for not being even MORE pro-life, should direct their energies toward the current Pope. He appears to have a lukewarm approach to the subject. He has provided a smiling warm welcome to those DEM politicians who have given public full throated support of PRO-abortion policy loud and clear. ( Here I mean his welcome to Biden, Pelosi and Whoopie Goldberg, etc, who have met the Pope in person.) NO American politician has any obligation at all to support a pro-life agenda, although many do. Its unfortunate but true that many who voice pro-life support end up voted out of office. If they had an opportunity to remain IN office, they could have helped enact MANY policies which would have assisted our poor and marginalized citizens. Voicing extreme pro-life legislation will almost guarantee they will be voted out of office and then able to accomplish NOTHING. Failing to vote for politicians who appear to be friendly to the pro-life agenda in at least SOME measure is cutting off your nose to spite your race. Like it or not, compromise MUST be used on this topic. Otherwise you will not even get the “half a loaf”. You will in fact get NONE. How on earth does that help anyone or save ANY babies??? Progress is most often made in increments, not in one fell swoop. If you cant see the difference between a party which supports abortion til the day of birth, and one which might allow some rare exceptions but does not support 3rd trimester abortion at all, do us all a favor and stay at home election day.
LJ above – Thanks for your comments.
The battle continues and you’re right, Pope Francis’ welcome mat isn’t helping. And he doesn’t have the problem (excuse) of having to win power.
Retort to Carl. I want to reply to your comment on disparagement of Trump, but you no longer seem to accept a reply.
Carl E. Olson
JULY 23, 2024 AT 12:04 PM
“Don’t follow Trump by using vial disparagements.”
“Says the guy who disparages Trump at every turn. Pot meet kettle, etc.”
Give me an example.
I don’t use disparagements like, “crooked Joe, crooked Kamala, wackjob E. Jean Carroll, AG Barr a fat pig, lock her up Hilliary Clinton…
Pot? I cook with a pot and a kettle every day.
Thanks
I think in the first place it’s not clear if you meant to write vile but you put “vial”.
If you meant “vial disparagements” it would be an image of disparagements lumped into a sort of container. Like pot and kettle in a combined metaphorical sense.
If you meant “vile” then you’re emphasizing the disparaging and that you think Trump doesn’t deserve that. Pot and kettle in traditional metaphor.
Trump has disappointed A LOT OF PEOPLE and I am not surprised it isn’t going over well. He’s also multiplying his overlaying of his self-management, eg., as we just saw, “I’m going to tell you what I experienced with that bullet and then I never want to have to talk about it again.” Since when there’s Presidential immunity for that?
Some tenants pay rent and suddenly they’re never accountable again. Trump wants to live in your head rent free (not my metaphor but it’s spectacular! at least it’s not VP Harris!) and then even with exempting himself from paying rent he wants to then be unaccountable! Haha good one!
John Allan,
Every election cycle either party comes up with scare tactics and hype. Project 2025 is just the latest one for the DNC. I haven’t seen it getting much traction lately so they probably have other plans in the works to distract voters with
And Opus Dei is not a powerful, sinister organization. That’s more spin.